Confusing Units after using Bernoulli's Equation

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the application of Bernoulli's equation to determine the exit velocity of air from a depressurized spacecraft and the implications of this scenario on sonic booms in a fictional context. Participants explore the validity of the equation used, the nature of compressible versus incompressible flow, and the conditions under which sonic booms may occur.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant calculates the exit velocity of air using Bernoulli's equation but expresses confusion about the units resulting in velocity.
  • Another participant questions whether the square root in the equation correctly reduces the units from m²/s² to m/s.
  • A different participant points out that the equation used is appropriate for incompressible flows, which may not apply to the scenario involving compressible air.
  • Some participants discuss the conditions under which a sonic boom might occur when an object traveling at Mach 0.5 enters a depressurized spacecraft.
  • Concerns are raised about whether the escaping air would affect the relative speed of the object and the likelihood of a sonic boom occurring.
  • One participant notes that sound cannot propagate in a vacuum, suggesting that sonic booms would not occur in space but could happen once entering the atmosphere.
  • Another participant references a specific scene from a movie to illustrate their point about deceleration and the feasibility of the speeds depicted.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the applicability of Bernoulli's equation to compressible flow and the conditions for sonic booms. There is no consensus on the validity of the initial calculations or the implications for the fictional scenario discussed.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge limitations regarding the assumptions made about flow conditions and the applicability of equations to compressible versus incompressible fluids. The discussion also touches on the fictional context of the scenario, which may not adhere to real-world physics.

Who May Find This Useful

Readers interested in fluid dynamics, aerospace engineering, and the physics of sound in different environments may find this discussion relevant.

Mezentio
Messages
4
Reaction score
0
So in a spacecraft with regular air at 1 atm pressure, a hole gets punched in it (depressurizing it). I'm looking for the Exit Velocity of the air at t=0.

Using Units:
Internal Pressure: Pi = 1 atm = 101300 [kg / m*s2]
Air Density: \rho = 1.2 [kg / m3]

And Equation:
Pi = 0.5 * \rho * (Ve2)
...turns into
Ve = √( 2*Pi / \rho )

The answer I get is Ve = 410 [ m2 / s2 ]

How is Distance2 over Time2 a Velocity in this context?
I'm hoping to compare another object's relative wind-speed against this, and I'm not sure how.
Would a stationary object next to the escaping air feel like it's going 410 [m/s]?

Thanks in advance

P.S. Equation and Units were from: http://www.spaceacademy.net.au/flight/emg/spcdp.htm
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
So the square root in the equation didn't reduce m^2/s^2 to m/s?
 
Oh wow I'm really that dumb. Thanks.
 
Your equation doesn't work, however. You are using an equation meant for incompressible flows for a flow that is clearly compressible.
 
Hmm you're right - Wikipedia says the simple equation only works for gas at low speeds.

Although maybe I can get away with not having to go further into it - The big question I'm trying to answer is:

I'm assuming an object traveling Mach 0.5 towards the spacecraft , suddenly entering the spacecraft (pressurized at 1 atm, etc), shouldn't create a Sonic Boom.

But say the spacecraft opens the window right before the object gets there. Since the object's relative air-speed would be larger (because of the decompressing air rushing towards it), could the resulting escaping air cause a Sonic Boom as the object passes through the window?

Or would the lowered pressure cancel out the gained air-speed, making a Sonic Boom equally unlikely?

I can post this as a new thread if you like. Thanks again.

(I'm talking about Star Trek: Into the Darkness btw, where Kirk and
fly from ship-to-ship.)
 
Well considering that you are out in space, no, there would be no sonic boom out in space. Sound can't propagate in a vacuum (or near vacuum, as it were). In relation to the movie, the two were flying through space where Mach number has no meaning since there is no speed of sound. Once they entered the atmosphere in the ship there certainly could be provided that their speed of movement was faster than the speed of sound relative to the moving air.

The answer to your question originally is that, given the pressures involved (1 atm inside, 0 atm outside), the air will be moving at precisely Mach 1 at the exit of the hatch, meaning that the two would pretty much have to be moving supersonically right as they enter that air and there would almost certainly be a sonic boom of some kind. The only real question is how long they would be traveling that fast once the air resistance starts. A sonic boom can only be heard behind the advancing wavefront from the shocks coming off the moving object, so if they slowed fast enough the boom may not be heard by anyone inside the hold.
 
Ok interesting, thanks.

I got interested in this because in the movie, the android calls out their distance twice - "1800 meters", (waits 1.3 seconds), "1600 meters." Which means that according to the movie, they're going exactly 154 m/s (344 mph), and decelerate to 0 m/s in 16 seconds with nothing but air and the seat of their pants to slow them down.

Ever seen a Motorcycle wreck? Ever see one going 344 mph? Not pretty
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
4K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
4K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
24K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
1K
Replies
2
Views
1K