Finding Horizontal Force in a Crank at 10N

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around determining the horizontal force exerted by a crank when a tangential force of 10N is applied. Participants explore the application of trigonometric functions to resolve the force components at various angles, particularly at 45 degrees, and examine the implications of these calculations.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant asserts that at 45 degrees, the horizontal force should be 5N, based on the assumption that the force divides equally between horizontal and vertical components.
  • Another participant challenges this view, stating that a 10N force at a diagonal does not simply split into equal horizontal and vertical components.
  • There is a discussion about the appropriate use of trigonometric functions, with one participant noting that cosine and sine ratios should be applied to determine the horizontal and vertical components of the force.
  • One participant expresses surprise that the trigonometric functions they are familiar with do not seem to apply as expected in this scenario.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the correct horizontal force at 45 degrees, with competing views on how the force components should be calculated and interpreted.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved assumptions regarding the application of trigonometric functions and the interpretation of force components at different angles. The discussion highlights the complexity of resolving forces in non-orthogonal directions.

richard9678
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I'm trying to establish the force in the horizontal direction of a crank when the force that is tangent to the crank is 10N.

Zero degrees is on top of a circle. Clearly, when the crank is vertical which corresponds to it being at zero degrees, the force in the horizontal plane is normal to the crank and is 10N. When the crank is at 90 degrees, the force is vertical and zero in the horizontal.

Now, when the crank is at 45 degrees, the force is acting partly vertical, partly horizontally in equal values, so the the horizontal force should be 5N.

I was hoping to apply either sine, cosine or tangent math to tell me the horizontal force, but neither do. Sin 45 is 0.707, cos 45 is 0.707 and tan 45 is 1. That surprises me that non of the trig. math I'm familiar with has found application in this problem.
 
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richard9678 said:
I was hoping to apply either sine, cosine or tangent math to tell me the horizontal force, but neither do.
You are right that ##\cos{45}=\sqrt{2}/2\approx.707##. How is is that not working?
 
richard9678 said:
Now, when the crank is at 45 degrees, the force is acting partly vertical, partly horizontally in equal values, so the the horizontal force should be 5N.
This is mistaken. A force of 10N on a diagonal does not break into halves at 5N horizontal and 5N vertical.
 
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OK. So, cosθ or sinθ is the correct trig. ratio to use to establish force provided by a crank lever, in the vertical or horizontal as the case may be. Never fully appreciated that at 45 degrees the tangential force does not simply divide into a half of the force at a tangent to the crank. I do now. Thanks.
 

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