Create an Installment Plan for Mr. Budi's Annuity

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around creating an installment plan for Mr. Budi's loan of 2,000,000 IDR, which is to be amortized over 10 annuities at an interest rate of 10% per year. Participants explore the calculations involved in determining the annuity payment and address discrepancies in the results obtained through different methods or calculators.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant calculates the annuity payment to be 1,228,913.42 IDR using a specific formula involving a geometric series.
  • Another participant expresses concern that the calculated annuity seems excessively high, suggesting it implies paying back more than half the loan in the first year.
  • There is a request for a re-evaluation of the calculations, with a focus on the expression $2,000,000 \times \frac{0.1}{1-1.1^{-10}}$.
  • Some participants note that their calculators yield the same results for both $1-1.1^{-10}$ and $\frac{0.1}{1-1.1^{-10}}$, raising questions about the accuracy of the calculations.
  • A suggestion is made to simplify the expression by using a variable $v = \frac{1}{1.1}$ to avoid confusion in calculations.
  • Another participant provides a standard formula for calculating the payment, indicating that it could have been found through a simple search.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the accuracy of the annuity calculation, with some questioning the high value obtained and others defending the methodology. There is no consensus on the correct approach or the validity of the results, as multiple interpretations and calculations are presented.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight potential confusion arising from the use of certain expressions and the results from different calculators. The discussion reveals a reliance on specific mathematical formulations and assumptions that may not be universally accepted or understood.

Monoxdifly
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Mr. Budi borrows 2,000,000IDR which will be amortized with 10 annuities. The first annuity will be paid in 1 year with 10% per year interest. Make the installment plan!
For the annuity I got A = [math]M\times\frac1{\sum_{n=1}^p(1+i)^{-n}}[/math] = [math]2,000,000\times\frac1{\sum_{n=1}^{10}(1+0,1)^{-n}}[/math] = [math]2,000,000\times\frac1{\sum_{n=1}^{10}(1,1)^{-n}}[/math] = [math]2,000,000\times\frac1{\sum_{n=1}^{10}(1,1)^{-n}}[/math] = [math]2,000,000\times\frac1{(1,1)^{-1}+(1,1)^{-2}+(1,1)^{-3}+(1,1)^{-4}+(1,1)^{-5}+(1,1)^{-6}+(1,1)^{-7}+(1,1)^{-8}+(1,1)^{-9}+(1,1)^{-10}}[/math]
([math](1,1)^{-1} + (1,1)^{-2} + … + (1,1)^{-10}[/math] is a geometric sequence with the first term [math]a = (1,1)^{-1}[/math] and ratio [math]r = (1,1)^{-1}[/math])
= [math]2,000,000\times\frac1{\frac{1-1.1^{-10}}{0.1}}[/math] = [math]2,000,000\times\frac{0.1}{1-1.1^{-10}}[/math] = 2,000,000 × 0.61445671 = 1,228,913.42
Thus, the annuity is 1,228,913.42.
On the end of first year:
Annuity = 1,228,913.42IDR
Interest : 10% × 2,000,000IDR = 200,000IDR
Installment : 1,228,913.42IDR – 200.000IDR = 1,028,913.42IDR
Remaining loan : 2,000,000IDR – 1,028,913.42IDR = 971,086.58IDR
On the end of second year:
Annuity = 1,228,913.42IDR
Interest : 10% × 971,086.58IDR = 97,108.66IDR
Installment : 1,228,913.42IDR – 97,108.66IDR = 1,131,804.76IDR
Remaining loan : 971,086.58IDR – 1,131,804.76IDR = -159.718,58IDR
Why am I seeing negatives already?
 
Last edited:
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Monoxdifly said:
Thus, the annuity is 1,228,913.42.
I’m no expert on these things but this figure looks way too high to me. It means that at the end of the first of ten years you would have to pay back more than half the amount of your loan already.
 
Monoxdifly said:
Mr. Budi borrows 2,000,000IDR which will be amortized with 10 annuities. The first annuity will be paid in 1 year with 10% per year interest. Make the installment plan!

Try that again...

$2,000,000\times\frac{0.1}{1-1.1^{-10}} = 2,000,000 \times \dfrac{0.1}{0.61445671}$
 
It's weird. My calculator app gives the same result for both $$1-1.1^{-10}$$ and $$\frac{0.1}{1-1.1^{-10}}$$.
 
Monoxdifly said:
It's weird. My calculator app gives the same result for both $$1-1.1^{-10}$$ and $$\frac{0.1}{1-1.1^{-10}}$$.

1) Delete that app, or
2) Add parentheses.
 
tkhunny said:
2) Add parentheses.

Both 1-1.1^(-10) and 0.1/(1-1.1^(-10)) yield the same results on the calculator. And it seems like it's Windows calculator.
 
$$1-1.1^{-10}\ =\ 0.61445671057046825263559635552114$$

$$\frac{0.1}{1-1.1^{-10}}\ =\ 0.1627453948825116076230715715748$$

on my Windows calculator.
 
Monoxdifly said:
Both 1-1.1^(-10) and 0.1/(1-1.1^(-10)) yield the same results on the calculator. And it seems like it's Windows calculator.

Okay, that leaves the other option.

This is why I do not recommend carrying such expressions as $1.1^{-10}$. Too much confusion.

I MUCH prefer this version:

$v = \dfrac{1}{1.1}$

$v^{10}$

So much cleaner.

Your ten payments are $v + v^{2} + ... + v^{10}$

Your sum is $\dfrac{v-v^{11}}{1-v}$, which is just as easily converted to $\dfrac{v\cdot\left(1-v^{10}\right)}{v\cdot i} = \dfrac{1-v^{10}}{i}$ if you like.

So much less to go wrong.
 
STANDARD formula (google would have given it to you Mr.Fly!):
P = Ai / (1-v) where v = 1 / (1+i)^n (same as TK's)

P = ?
A = 2,000,000
i = .10
n = 10
 

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