Dependence of force on relative position and velocity

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of force dependence on relative position and velocity between two bodies, exploring the implications of this statement in the context of various physical forces. Participants delve into the theoretical underpinnings, particularly focusing on symmetries in physics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about the statement that force depends only on relative position and velocity, seeking clarification on its basis.
  • Another participant clarifies that this means the force cannot depend on the position or velocity relative to any other reference point, using the example of weight remaining the same if Earth were moved to another galaxy.
  • A different participant suggests that this statement is related to the translational and rotational symmetry of space, indicating that the potential energy between two bodies depends solely on their relative position.
  • This participant notes that the force can be derived from the potential energy, which is a function of the distance between the bodies, and mentions various types of forces (gravitational, electrostatic, magnetostatic, electromagnetic, nuclear) that share this characteristic.
  • Another participant asks for resources to learn more about the symmetries mentioned in the discussion.
  • A link to Wikipedia articles on continuous symmetries, Lie groups, and spacetime symmetries is provided as a resource for further exploration.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the concept that forces depend on relative position and velocity, but the discussion includes varying interpretations and implications of this idea, particularly regarding the underlying symmetries in physics.

Contextual Notes

The discussion touches on complex concepts such as translational and rotational symmetry, potential energy, and various force types, which may involve assumptions and definitions that are not fully explored in the thread.

Felipe Lincoln
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I read that a force between two bodies can only depend on their relative position and relative velocity. But I can't understand in what is this statement leaning on and what it means.
 
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It means that it can't be dependent on their position of velocity relative to anything else.
In other words, if we moved planet Earth to another galaxy, but you were in the same position relative to the Earth, then you would still have the same weight.
 
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I think this statement is leaning (at least partially) on the translational and rotational symmetry of space. Due to those symmetries the potential V of one body due to the presence of the other body, depends only on their relative position so it is ##V(r)## where ##r=|r1-r2|##. The force is the gradient of V, ##\vec{F}=-\nabla V##.

What it means is that whether we consider gravitational forces or electrostatic forces (between electrically charged bodies), or magnetostatic forces (between magnetized bodies), or electromagnetic forces (for example the Lorenz force and the Laplace force), or nuclear forces (for example between quarks and gluons), all of these types of forces have something in common, that they can only depend on the relative position of the bodies and their relative velocities.
 
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Thanks for the answers.
On what subject will I learn more about these symmetries?
 

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