Difference Between Proper Time and Coordinate Time Explained

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the distinction between proper time and coordinate time, exploring their definitions and implications in the context of physics. Participants reference a Stack Exchange thread and a related paper discussing the nature of time, particularly in relation to quantum mechanics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that coordinate time is the parameter in physics equations that describes how states change, while proper time is measured through correlations between events, such as clock hands and chemical reactions.
  • Another participant questions the validity of the initial claims due to the lack of context from the quoted source.
  • It is clarified that coordinate time serves as a coordinate label for events in spacetime, whereas proper time is the time measured on a clock between two events on its worldline.
  • A further explanation likens proper time to the "distance" along a timelike worldline, contrasting it with coordinate time as a label on events.
  • Participants express that the discussion in the referenced Stack Exchange thread does not pertain to coordinate or proper time, but rather to the concept of time emerging from quantum entanglement.
  • One participant elaborates that in quantum mechanics, time is treated as a parameter that does not correspond to measurable physical changes, complicating the relationship between measured time and theoretical constructs.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach consensus on the relevance of the Stack Exchange discussion to the concepts of proper and coordinate time, with some asserting that it is unrelated while others seek clarification on the definitions.

Contextual Notes

Participants express limitations in understanding due to the lack of specific references to the original source material, which affects the clarity of the discussion.

TheQuestionGuy14
Messages
158
Reaction score
8
I was reading up on the nature of time and found this: "
In one sense, "time" is the time that is in the equations of physics. That's the t in the equations of the paper, it's the parameter that describes how the states of all systems in the universe change."
Does this explain coordinate time?

And this:
"However, actual measurements from within the universe cannot measure "t". All they can do is look at the correlation between the state of one thing - say, the hands of a clock - and the state of another thing - say, the conditions of a chemical reaction. So when we actually measure time, what we're measuring is these correlations."
Does this explain proper time?

If not, what are the difference between them, in layman's terms?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
TheQuestionGuy14 said:
I was reading up on the nature of time

Where? Please give a specific reference. We can't discuss out of context quotes from an unknown source.
 
PeterDonis said:
Where? Please give a specific reference. We can't discuss out of context quotes from an unknown source.
It was on physics stack exchange, I asked about the nature of time and that was their answer, are they describing coordinate time and proper time, or are they wrong?
 
TheQuestionGuy14 said:
It was on physics stack exchange

Which page? Give a link.

TheQuestionGuy14 said:
I asked about the nature of time and that was their answer, are they describing coordinate time and proper time, or are they wrong?

Again: we cannot discuss out of context quotes from an unknown source. Either give a specific link to the actual discussion you're asking about or this thread will be closed.
 
TheQuestionGuy14 said:
what are the difference between them, in layman's terms?

Coordinate time is a coordinate label that you put on events in spacetime (more precisely, one of four coordinate labels that you put on each event, assuming you are using appropriate coordinates).

Proper time is the time elapsed on a clock between two events on the clock's worldline.
 
Proper time is the "distance" along a timelike worldline. If you arrange a set of parallel inertial (i.e. straight) timelike worldlines, this is one direction of a grid. If you agree a zero on all of the lines (preferably so that the zeros form a line orthogonal to each timelike line) then you have coordinate time.

It's exactly like the distinction between the length of any old line and the length along a set of parallel straight lines (which you'd call a y-coordinate) in Euclidean geometry.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Cryo
TheQuestionGuy14 said:
Then what is the person who replied talking about?

Not coordinate time or proper time. So if you were hoping to get information about what those are, that StackExchange thread is not the way to do it--nor is the paper linked to there.

TheQuestionGuy14 said:
The experiment wants to show that time emerges from quantum entanglement, he states only measured time is, and parametric time isn't, what is he talking about?

In quantum mechanics (more precisely, non-relativistic QM), the time ##t## is a parameter; the state of the overall quantum system is a function of this parameter, but the parameter is just imposed by the theory, it has nothing to do with anything that's measured or anything physical.

"Measured time" in the paper is the change in the correlations between the subsystems of the overall quantum system as measurements are made on them, interpreted as evidence of "time flowing", as part of a proposal made by the authors of the paper on how we, as individual subsystems in the universe, could perceive time to be flowing (or, to put it another way, things to be changing), when, if you try to apply non-relativistic QM to the whole universe and assign the whole universe a quantum state, the Hamiltonian you get out of it says the state of the whole universe never changes at all as a function of the parameter ##t##.

As above, none of this has anything to do with either coordinate time or proper time as those concepts are used in relativity. A discussion of the paper and the StackExchange thread really belongs in the QM forum, not here, if that's what you want to ask about. But such a discussion has nothing to do with coordinate time or proper time.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 47 ·
2
Replies
47
Views
3K
  • · Replies 32 ·
2
Replies
32
Views
3K
  • · Replies 17 ·
Replies
17
Views
3K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
810
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
1K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
897
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
1K
  • · Replies 33 ·
2
Replies
33
Views
2K
  • · Replies 48 ·
2
Replies
48
Views
6K
  • · Replies 37 ·
2
Replies
37
Views
4K