Do Electron's move around an atom?

  • #26
If an electron has momentum in an atomic orbital then surely it is in motion?
And if you know the mass and the momentum
of the electron then you can surely calculate its velocity?
 
  • #27
ZapperZ
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Bob Eldritch said:
If an electron has momentum in an atomic orbital then surely it is in motion?
And if you know the mass and the momentum
of the electron then you can surely calculate its velocity?

The same thing with "spin" as not being the same as the classical spin, "angular momentum" should also not be confused with the classical analogue. It isn't the same. Why?

(i) how do you describe classically the s orbital with angular momentum quantum number being zero?

(ii) how do you describe the PHASE of the orbital that is so crucial in the formation of bonds in chemistry? We have zero classical analogue for this.

Zz.
 
  • #28
ZapperZ said:
The same thing with "spin" as not being the same as the classical spin, "angular momentum" should also not be confused with the classical analogue. It isn't the same. Why?
(i) how do you describe classically the s orbital with angular momentum quantum number being zero?
(ii) how do you describe the PHASE of the orbital that is so crucial in the formation of bonds in chemistry? We have zero classical analogue for this.
Zz.

But then I'm talking about the the motion of the electron around the the nucleus, not the electron's spin angular momentum.
 
  • #29
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Bob Eldritch said:
But then I'm talking about the the motion of the electron around the the nucleus, not the electron's spin angular momentum.

And I was talking about the "orbital angular momentum", and not "spin", or else talking about the s orbital is meaningless. There's no "s orbital" for spin.

Zz.
 
  • #30
I was thinking that If Electrons Don't move then how would you explain electricity? Would the whole wavefunction move?
 
  • #31
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simon009988 said:
I was thinking that If Electrons Don't move then how would you explain electricity? Would the whole wavefunction move?

You then have shifted gear. The ORIGINAL question was on electrons bound within an atom. Now, you're asking about the conduction electrons in metals which are now described NOT as electrons bound to an atom, but rather to the whole bulk crystal with Bloch functions. This is now governed by a different description. The Bloch wavefunction now describes such a process if you want to be accurate. However, in many instances, a "free electron gas" description is often good enough. Ohm's law, for example can be derived from such a scenerio.

Do not be confused between the use of QM description in some circumstances with the use of classical description with it is called for under other circumstances. Electrons in particle accelerators are very often described via classical description. However, such usage in the atomic scenario will lead to absurd and self-contradicting results.

Zz.
 
  • #32
Electrons moving around the nucleus would make sharing of electrons by atoms impractical as well as creating a "traffic control" problem to keep them from colliding with each other.

Electrons have traditionally been considered to have a negative charge causing them to repell each other and be attracted to the positively charged nucleus. It would be more likely that these charges would result in an equilibrium condition in which the electrons held constant postions relative to each other and to the nucleus unless energy was added or substracted such as when absorbing and emitting radiation. The need to establish an equilibrium based on a fixed number of electrons would explain the need to share electrons with other atoms.

Electrons held in position by their charges could function as if they existed collectively as a wave. They would move toward and away from the nucleus(when emitting or absorbing radiation) in unison like a wave moving in and out.
 

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