Does an Atom Lose Energy? Understanding the Role of EM Waves and Photons

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    Atom Energy
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around whether an atom loses energy, particularly focusing on the behavior of electrons within atoms and the implications of electromagnetic (EM) waves and quantum mechanics (QM). Participants explore concepts related to energy loss, radiation, and the nature of electrons in atomic structures.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that a moving charged particle, like an electron, generates EM waves when it changes direction, which could imply energy loss.
  • Others argue that while acceleration can lead to energy gain, deceleration could result in energy loss, but this is context-dependent.
  • A participant suggests that electrons in atoms do not lose energy due to acceleration or deceleration, but rather due to the EM waves produced by these changes.
  • Some participants assert that quantum mechanics prevents electrons from losing energy through radiation, countering classical expectations that they would spiral inward.
  • There is a discussion about the nature of electrons, with some stating they do not orbit like planets but exist as wave-like clouds, which complicates the notion of energy loss.
  • Concerns are raised about applying classical physics principles to quantum systems, indicating a fundamental difference in behavior at microscopic scales.
  • Several participants acknowledge the complexity of the topic and suggest that a deeper understanding of quantum mechanics is necessary to fully grasp the concepts discussed.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding energy loss in atoms, particularly the role of quantum mechanics versus classical physics. The discussion remains unresolved, with no consensus on the nature of energy loss in atomic systems.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence on classical versus quantum mechanical interpretations, and the challenge of explaining complex quantum phenomena in simple terms. There are unresolved questions about the specifics of energy transfer and the behavior of electrons in atoms.

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Hi
I was wondering whether atom loses its energy. From what I know, a moving charged particle, let`s say electron, has magnetic field and if the particle changes direction, the field changes as well. Change in electro-magnetic field is a wave, EM waves are propagating in photons and a photon has energy. So am I missing something or does atom really lose energy?
Thanks for answers
 
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...but in when a particle changes its direction [of motion] it accelerates in a EM field. Accelerates = gains energy...
Though, yes, it can have a acceleration in the opposite direction of motion [deceleration] and lose energy.
 
I'm afraid Edi doesn't have it quite right here.

An electron in an atom would lose energy by radiation, if it were not for quantum mechanics. In fact, QM was developed to answer the questions "why are atoms so big and last so long", because classically,` the electrons would keep spiraling inward.
 
To be more clear, by particle I meant electron in atom. Elctrons in atom are moving chaoticly and chaoticly moving charged particle creates EM waves.

Edi said:
...but in when a particle changes its direction [of motion] it accelerates in a EM field. Accelerates = gains energy...
Though, yes, it can have a acceleration in the opposite direction of motion [deceleration] and lose energy.

I agree, but if this acceleration/deceleration happens in a closed system of an atom - core and electrons, there is no loss of energy of an atom due to acceleration or deceleration of its electrons, but due to EM waves generated by this acceleration or deceleration - if I am not mistaken.
 
Vanadium 50 said:
I'm afraid Edi doesn't have it quite right here.

An electron in an atom would lose energy by radiation, if it were not for quantum mechanics. In fact, QM was developed to answer the questions "why are atoms so big and last so long", because classically,` the electrons would keep spiraling inward.

Oh yes, I tought that QM explains that... but I am not so familiar with it, so I still do not understand why exactly electron doesn`t lose its energy by radiation - why doesn`t it radiate, even though "classically" it should ?
 
This question really bothered physicists some 100 years ago. It was successfully resolved with the advent of quantum mechanics. No, atom does not lose energy in a stationary state.
 
With loosing energy i kinda meant kinetic energy...
I interpreted the question as, well, when an electron accelerates in a EM field, it emits a photon - where does this energy comes from?
Not from the atom/ particle it self, but from the accelerating force. So no, [yes] atom does not loose energy.
Electrons do not really fly around the nuclei like planets around the Sun. There more like wave-like cloud or something, electrons don't lose energy while orbiting the nuclei - they do not orbit it and thus accelerate and lose a photon... (?)
 
Oh yes, I tought that QM explains that... but I am not so familiar with it, so I still do not understand why exactly electron doesn`t lose its energy by radiation - why doesn`t it radiate, even though "classically" it should ?

Because we are applying macroscopic physics to the microscopic universe. Classical physics is great for the mid macro level where we are at, but the electron isn't governed by those principles. They're not technically particles.
 
It will be difficult to explain "why" other than "QM says so" in a few lines. Whole books have been written about QM's role in this - if you are interested in learning, I would suggest taking a class on QM.
 
  • #10
Thanks for answers.
Vanadium 50 said:
It will be difficult to explain "why" other than "QM says so" in a few lines. Whole books have been written about QM's role in this - if you are interested in learning, I would suggest taking a class on QM.

Seems that those classes on QM are inevitable...
 

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