Errors in Ballentine (QM Textbook)?

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Discussion Overview

This thread discusses perceived errors and interpretations in the textbook "Quantum Mechanics" by Ballentine, particularly focusing on his treatment of the Copenhagen interpretation and the implications for quantum measurement. Participants explore the appropriateness of Ballentine's text for learners at different levels and the depth of its foundational discussions.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Meta-discussion

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants claim that Ballentine misrepresents the Copenhagen interpretation and lacks a clear statement of state collapse, leading to incorrect conclusions about experimental results.
  • Specific references to Ballentine's text are provided, including Section 9.5, where he allegedly suggests that evidence contradicts the Copenhagen interpretation.
  • Concerns are raised about Ballentine's interpretation of the watched pot experiment and his historical review of quantum mechanics, which some argue contains misleading language regarding simultaneous measurements of position and momentum.
  • Some participants express uncertainty about the suitability of Ballentine's textbook for beginners, comparing it to other texts that may present foundational concepts more clearly.
  • Others argue that despite its errors, Ballentine's text offers a deeper discussion of foundational issues in quantum mechanics compared to more superficial treatments in other textbooks.
  • There is a suggestion that Ballentine's Ensemble Interpretation lacks clarity regarding hidden variables, contrasting it with Einstein's interpretation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views, with some agreeing on the presence of errors in Ballentine's text while others defend its depth and educational value. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the overall quality and appropriateness of Ballentine's approach to quantum mechanics.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the errors discussed may constitute a small percentage of the text, but the implications for foundational understanding are debated. The level of the textbook is also questioned, with some suggesting it is more appropriate for advanced learners.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to students and educators in quantum mechanics, particularly those evaluating the suitability of different textbooks for learning and teaching foundational concepts.

  • #121
A. Neumaier said:
Measurement is not a notion of QFT. Microcausality says by definition that field operators commute or anticommute at spacelike pairs of arguments. This implies (and is indeed equivalent to) the statement that arbitrary observables with spacelike separated support commute.
I don't understand the first sentence. QFT as any physical theory is about the mathematical description of observable facts of nature and thus it makes observable predictions (cross sections for scattering, the blackbody spectrum, etc.). Measurement is as much a notion of QFT as it is for non-relativistic QM.
 
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  • #122
vanhees71 said:
that's indeed what's usually understood to be "no causal effect"

Not in the many papers in the literature that struggle with how to interpret correlations that violate the Bell inequalities. Perhaps that's not a problem for you, but it is for many.
 
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  • #123
It's a problem for proponents of the collapse assumption. It's no problem for proponents of the ensemble interpretation.
 
  • #124
Moderator's note: Some posts have been moved to the "Difference Between Collapse and Projection" thread in the interpretations forum.
 
  • #125
vanhees71 said:
No, you need to take a partial trace and describe the evolution by some master equation. That can be FAPP a kind of "state reduction", but it's nothing outside the dynamical laws of QT!

This is wrong. The partial trace does not derive state reduction. The partial trace derives the state update for non-selective measurements. It does not derive the state update for selective measurements. Mathematically, this is because a mixed density matrix does not have a unique decomposition as a mixture of pure states.
https://pages.uoregon.edu/svanenk/solutions/Mixed_states.pdf (see comments #22 and #55-57)
 
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  • #126
vanhees71 said:
See Weinberg, QT of fields vol. 1 for a comprehensive treatment of these issues for fields of arbitrary spin.

This QFT reference also give the state reduction postulate in Eq 2.1.7 (in the old fashioned way as part of the Born rule). Earlier in the chapter, he also writes that QFT is based on the same postulates as QM.
 
  • #127
The thread has gotten far away from just discussing errors in Ballentine, and we already have another thread in the interpretations forum for discussing different concepts of what "state reduction" means.

Thread closed.
 
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