Expanding math space implies expanding space?

  • Context: Undergrad 
  • Thread starter Thread starter negativzero
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Expanding Space
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the relationship between the mathematical description of an electron's potential path and the concept of physical space expansion. Participants explore whether the expanding mathematical space implies an actual expansion of physical space, considering both quantum mechanics and general relativity.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that the minimal necessary math to describe an electron's potential path expands over time, questioning if this implies a physical space expansion.
  • Another participant challenges the claim that the mathematical description of an electron's potential path expands, particularly for an electron in an energy eigenstate.
  • A later reply introduces the idea of Feynman's path integral approach as a way to visualize quantum mechanics, noting that the concept of expansion may not apply in the same way when not observed.
  • There is mention of the spreading of wave-packets in quantum mechanics, but it is noted that interpretations of what a state is can vary significantly.
  • One participant expresses a desire for mercy from those knowledgeable in general relativity, indicating a perceived complexity in the discussion.
  • Another participant offers resources for further reading and suggests that understanding the formalism is necessary before delving into general relativity and expansion concepts.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on whether the expanding mathematical description implies physical space expansion. There are competing views regarding the validity of the initial claim and the implications of quantum mechanics.

Contextual Notes

Participants express varying levels of familiarity with the mathematical concepts involved, which may influence their interpretations and arguments. The discussion includes references to specific quantum mechanics interpretations and the complexities surrounding them.

Who May Find This Useful

Individuals interested in the intersection of quantum mechanics and general relativity, as well as those exploring the implications of mathematical descriptions in physics.

negativzero
Messages
120
Reaction score
0
The minimal necessary math to describe the potential path of an electron expands over time. Second by second, the space necessary to describe the possible positions of the electron expands.
.
Does that imply expansion of physical space? And does that shift the explanation of the expansion of space from the General Relativists assumption of "initial conditions" to a quantum explanation.
.
Please. I'm only lawyer with a smattering of math courses. Have mercy GR guys. For once. Just have mercy on me this time.
 
Astronomy news on Phys.org
Help! Why doesn't potential equal expansion?
 
negativzero said:
The minimal necessary math to describe the potential path of an electron expands over time. Second by second, the space necessary to describe the possible positions of the electron expands.
I don’t think this is true, at least not for an electron in an energy eigenstate. That is the reason that energy eigenstates are probably the most commonly discussed states.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: bhobba
negativzero said:
Please. I'm only lawyer with a smattering of math courses. Have mercy GR guys. For once. Just have mercy on me this time.

I'm sincerely curious why the thought of needing mercy crossed your mind.
 
negativzero said:
Please. I'm only lawyer with a smattering of math courses. Have mercy GR guys. For once. Just have mercy on me this time.

That's all you need. Simply read the following in the sequence posted and much will be clear, and you can do a post to clarify any further queries:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/0465075681/?tag=pfamazon01-20
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XC7F6QG/?tag=pfamazon01-20
https://www.amazon.com/dp/0241293324/?tag=pfamazon01-20

To answer your query you are possibly thinking of Feynman's path integral approach. Its just a pictorial way of looking at what's called the path integral - which isn't really an integral in the usual sense - but that is just by the by for now - I can explain it exactly once you have read the above. Whats going on when not observed QM is silent about - there is no 'expansion' - going on - except regarding the spreading of wave-packets - but since what a state is, is hotly contested in various interpretations, that's not the best way of looking at that either - best to just spend a bit of time understanding the formalism. You are a Lawyer - you are a smart dude - you can do it. It will just take a bit pf time.

When you have finished the field theory book I can explain GR, and expansion, very easily using something called Lovelock's Theorem - but not now - you need a bit of background first

Thanks
Bill
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: JMz

Similar threads

  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 17 ·
Replies
17
Views
3K
  • · Replies 28 ·
Replies
28
Views
3K
  • · Replies 48 ·
2
Replies
48
Views
4K
  • · Replies 27 ·
Replies
27
Views
4K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 29 ·
Replies
29
Views
6K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
3K