Explaining how the Higgs fields gives particles mass

In summary, physicists say that the Higgs Field slows particles down from the speed of light, using the analogy of syrup. It is suggested that it would be more accurate to say that particles do not exist, only fields, and their speed is determined by the strength of their coupling with the Higgs Field. This variation in speed has the same effect as inertial mass and is equivalent to gravitational mass according to the equivalence principle. However, there is no reference for this statement and it is argued that it would be better to explain the concept of coupling between fields in a more popular science manner. Additionally, it is mentioned that this could also explain the existence of dark matter, as it only couples with the Higgs Field. There is some discussion
  • #1
Stevexyz
25
3
TL;DR Summary
Physicists say the Higgs Field is like syrup and slows particles down from the speed of light.
Physicists say the Higgs Field is like syrup and slows particles down from the speed of light. Wouldn’t it be easier and more correct to say there are no particles, just fields, and the strength of the coupling of the electron, photon, quark etc. fields with the Higgs field determines their speed. This variation in speed has the same effect as inertial mass and due to the equivalence principle is the same as gravitational mass?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
  • #2
Stevexyz said:
Summary: Physicists say the Higgs Field is like syrup and slows particles down from the speed of light.

Physicists say the Higgs Field is like syrup and slows particles down from the speed of light.

Physicists say loads of wacky things in popular science. The purpose is to provide some kind of story which is totally not a lie, so that tax payers and politicians are willing to fund research. Particle physics is not cheap!

Anyway, would be nice if you provide references to your statement.

Now explain "coupling betweens fields" in a popular science manner, good luck
 
  • Like
  • Haha
Likes Delta2, berkeman and pinball1970
  • #3
Thanks for your reply. I have no reference for my statement. Just an assertion. Rather than using "syrup", why not just say fields interact (couple) with different strengths. This would also explain dark matter. Normal matter couples with both electromagnetic and Higgs fields. Dark matter only couples with the Higgs field. Also, is there anything wrong in saying the Higgs mechanism appears to give particles inertia rather than mass directly?
 
  • #4
Stevexyz said:
This would also explain dark matter. Normal matter couples with both electromagnetic and Higgs fields. Dark matter only couples with the Higgs field. Also, is there anything wrong in saying the Higgs mechanism appears to give particles inertia rather than mass directly?
Elaborate on "would also explain dark matter". There is no explanation there. Furthermore, particles can aqcuire mass without higgs mechanism too. Note that more than 99% of the mass of the proton for instance is not due to higgs mechanism. Anyway, dark matter is another topic for another thread

Inertia is an old concept, we do not talk about it so much anymore

Physicsists do not use syrup but I guess some do use that as some poor kind of analogy for popular science purposes. If you want to read about the higgs mechanism how physicsist thinks about it and Calculate with it, I can give you some professional references
 
  • Like
Likes Stevexyz
  • #5
Hi Dr Malawi, What do you mean by inertia is an old concept. Isn't inertia a fundamental quality described by the equivalence principle, that states gravitational and inertial forces are indistinguishable?
By "explaining" Higgs by coupling or the lack of coupling suggests trying to observe dark matter is a waste of time as there is no "weakly interacting field" to calculate.
Thanks for the discussion
 
  • Like
Likes Delta2
  • #6
Stevexyz said:
Hi Dr Malawi, What do you mean by inertia is an old concept. Isn't inertia a fundamental quality described by the equivalence principle, that states gravitational and inertial forces are indistinguishable?

Still an old concept. GR is more than 100 y old. The concept of mass in particle physics is something else. Masses in particle physics are also said to "run" with energy scale https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pole_mass
 
  • Like
Likes Stevexyz
  • #7
Could it be that "explaining" Higgs by the coupling or the lack of coupling of fields suggests trying to observe dark matter (mass but no electromagnetic force) is a waste of time as there is no "weakly interacting field" to calculate?
 
  • #8
I think you need / can start a new thread about dark matter candidates, it is a very broad field of research. There are many dark matter models, in some which those particles interact directly via the Higgs boson
https://home.cern/news/news/physics/atlas-probes-dark-matter-using-higgs-boson The signature would be Higgs -> nothing (there would be missing energy in the detector, similarly as we discover neutrions via indirect methods)
 
  • Like
Likes Stevexyz
  • #9
The A-level answer is that the Higgs couples left and right-handed Weyl fields. But I suspect you want an I-level or B-level answer.
 
  • Like
Likes nnunn and malawi_glenn
  • #10
Hi Vanadium 50, I am looking for an advanced answer - but only on whether the concept is sound - not on how to calculate it - at this stage. Thanks
 
  • #11
Stevexyz said:
Hi Vanadium 50, I am looking for an advanced answer - but only on whether the concept is sound - not on how to calculate it - at this stage. Thanks

Then it is not an advanced level if you do not intend to know how to calculate... advanced means what it means - at the level it is supposed to be understood - how physicsists actually thinks about it.

Page 532: http://web.physics.ucsb.edu/~mark/ms-qft-DRAFT.pdf if you want to read the nifty details
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #12
Hi,
I am also keen to grasp a very basic understanding the relationship between mass and inertia.
Thanks
Steve
 
  • #13
Stevexyz said:
Hi,
I am also keen to grasp a very basic understanding the relationship between mass and inertia.
Thanks
Steve
There is a quite recent thread about it in the classical physics section. This is a completely different question than in the op.

I can tell you this though, particle physics does deal with gravity (yet) so inertia is not in the realm of particle physics.
 
  • #14
Stevexyz said:
but only on whether the concept is sound
Your personal theory? It's not.
 
  • #15
Please give a link to where this theory has already been discussed. Thanks
 
  • #16
Stevexyz said:
Please give a link to where this theory has already been discussed. Thanks
What theory?
 
  • #17
Stevexyz said:
Summary: Physicists say the Higgs Field is like syrup and slows particles down from the speed of light.

Physicists say the Higgs Field is like syrup and slows particles down from the speed of light. Wouldn’t it be easier and more correct to say there are no particles, just fields, and the strength of the coupling of the electron, photon, quark etc. fields with the Higgs field determines their speed. This variation in speed has the same effect as inertial mass and due to the equivalence principle is the same as gravitational mass?
Stevexyz said:
Please give a link to where this theory has already been discussed. Thanks

No, that's not how things work at PF. If you want to discuss a new concept, YOU need to post the valid links to peer-reviewed articles to start your thread. You don't get to throw out your personal theory and ask others to find links to articles to support your ideas.

Thread is locked. Check your PMs. Have a nice day.
 
  • Like
Likes Stevexyz

FAQ: Explaining how the Higgs fields gives particles mass

1. What is the Higgs field?

The Higgs field is a theoretical concept in particle physics that is thought to permeate all of space. It is a type of energy field that is responsible for giving particles their mass.

2. How does the Higgs field give particles mass?

The Higgs field interacts with particles as they move through it, causing them to gain mass. This interaction is similar to how a person moving through water experiences resistance and therefore has a harder time moving.

3. Why is the Higgs field important in understanding the universe?

The Higgs field is important because it helps explain why particles have mass, which is a fundamental property of matter. Without the Higgs field, particles would not have mass and the universe would be very different.

4. How was the existence of the Higgs field confirmed?

The existence of the Higgs field was confirmed in 2012 by the Large Hadron Collider (LHC) at CERN. The LHC detected a particle called the Higgs boson, which is a manifestation of the Higgs field.

5. Are there any practical applications of understanding the Higgs field?

While the Higgs field may seem like a purely theoretical concept, understanding it has practical applications in technology. For example, the Higgs field plays a role in the development of superconductors, which have many important applications in fields such as medicine and energy production.

Similar threads

Replies
1
Views
1K
Replies
8
Views
2K
Replies
7
Views
2K
Replies
7
Views
2K
Replies
7
Views
2K
Replies
1
Views
1K
Replies
5
Views
2K
Back
Top