Finding specific heat C_p coefficients using NIST

Click For Summary
SUMMARY

The discussion focuses on finding specific heat coefficients (C_p) for water at approximately 300 K using the JANAF model, which represents C_p as a polynomial function of temperature (T). The coefficients in question are 9850.69, -48.6714, 0.13736, and -0.000127063. The user is unable to locate these coefficients in the NIST-JANAF tables and notes that the NIST data follows the Shomate equation, which differs from the polynomial form. The conversation also touches on deriving similar coefficients for liquid nitrogen within a specified temperature range.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of the JANAF model for specific heat coefficients
  • Familiarity with the Shomate equation for thermodynamic properties
  • Basic knowledge of thermodynamics and heat capacity concepts
  • Experience with data retrieval from NIST thermochemical databases
NEXT STEPS
  • Research the JANAF model and its application in thermodynamics
  • Study the Shomate equation and its differences from polynomial representations
  • Explore NIST's thermochemical data for water and liquid nitrogen
  • Learn about deriving thermophysical properties from empirical data
USEFUL FOR

Researchers, engineers, and students in thermodynamics, particularly those focused on specific heat calculations and the application of NIST data in thermal property analysis.

JD_PM
Messages
1,125
Reaction score
156
TL;DR
I am trying to find the specific heat (at constant pressure) ##C_p## coefficients linked to the JANAF model
I am trying to find the specific heat (at constant pressure) ##C_p## coefficients linked to the JANAF model, which basically assumes that ##C_p## is a polynomic function of ##T##, for liquid nitrogen (at ##\approx## 97 K).

Before doing that, I am trying to find those for water (at ##\approx## 300 K) and verify that they are ##9850.69, -48.6714, 0.13736## and ##-0.000127063##.

I am looking into NIST data for water; I checked both gas and condensed thermochemistry data but the coefficients don't match with the above. I also checked the NIST-JANAF thermo tables, for water, but the coefficients are not there.

How to find the desired coefficients for water (at ##\approx## 300 K)? They should be somewhere in the NIST-JANAF table.

Once I see the above it should be straightforward to find those for liquid nitrogen

Thank you! :biggrin:

PS: Actually, I am implementing the thermo-physical properties of liquid nitrogen.
 
Engineering news on Phys.org
JD_PM said:
Before doing that, I am trying to find those for water (at ##\approx## 300 K) and verify that they are ##9850.69, -48.6714, 0.13736## and ##-0.000127063##.
Where do these come from ? How do they lead to a ##\ c_p=75.349\ ## J/(K.mol) as expected ?

##\ ##
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: JD_PM
Just for the record, here's an explanation of the JANAF model

74897298478ddsd.png


BvU said:
Where do these come from ? How do they lead to a ##\ c_p=75.349\ ## J/(K.mol) as expected ?

##\ ##

Good question, here is the derivation.

I am trying to find the coefficients for liquid nitrogen online. However, I think the best I could do is follow the same procedure to derive them (not only for ##c_p## but for the density, dynamic viscosity and thermal conductivity).

So I am going to take the temperature range ##-193 < T < -173## Celsius (using ##80K < T < 100K## should also work).

First I am trying to find the density, ##c_p##, dynamic viscosity and thermal conductivity data associated to this temperature range (as done for water in the above derivation).
 
JD_PM said:
Good question, here is the derivation.

Still think there is a mismatch somewhere. I can find no way to get a reasonable ##c_p## with e.g. formula ##(23)## or ##(24)## with such coefficients $$9850.69*300^4 -48.6714*300^3+ 0.13736*300^2 -0.000127063*300 = 7.979 \times 10^{13}\ \ ?$$

##\ ##
 
JD_PM said:
I am looking into NIST data for water; I checked both gas and condensed thermochemistry data but the coefficients don't match with the above.
The NIST data is for the Shomate equation, which is not polynomial (note the ##E/t^2## term).
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: JD_PM
BvU said:
Still think there is a mismatch somewhere. I can find no way to get a reasonable ##c_p## with e.g. formula ##(23)## or ##(24)## with such coefficients $$9850.69*300^4 -48.6714*300^3+ 0.13736*300^2 -0.000127063*300 = 7.979 \times 10^{13}\ \ ?$$

##\ ##

There are no formulas numbered 23 nor 24. Did you mean 7.4 here?
 
JD_PM said:
Just for the record, here's an explanation of the JANAF model
https://www.physicsforums.com/attachments/298450
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
10K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
10K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
3K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
4K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
3K
Replies
54
Views
9K