# Finite space in infinite time

What is infinite?

The only candidate for infinity is matter itself, which does not necessarily imply infinite space or time, or infinite amount of matter, but it denotes that material forms are infinite, and relations between material forms are infinite.

Originally posted by Eh
The point I have been stressing is NOT that the BB must have been the beginning of time (though there are good reasons to believe so) but that it is logically consistent.
What is the 'logic' of a beginning of time?
Matter appearing from nowhere for no appearant reason??
That is just supernatural!

Eh
The universe appearing out of nowhere is a strawman. If you can find a logical inconsistency with a beginning to time, simply point it out. Strawman arguments don't cut it.

Eh
Originally posted by heusdens
What is infinite?

The only candidate for infinity is matter itself, which does not necessarily imply infinite space or time, or infinite amount of matter, but it denotes that material forms are infinite, and relations between material forms are infinite.
Since space has no existence without matter/energy, infinite matter is also necessarily infinite space.

Originally posted by Eh
Since space has no existence without matter/energy, infinite matter is also necessarily infinite space.
Einfuhrung in der dialektischen und historischen materialismus (Dietz Verlag 1980 Berlin)

Kapitel V

Materie und ihrer Existenzformen

4. Die Unendlichkeit der Materie

(...)

"Die philosophische Erkenntnis von der Unendlichkeit der Materie widerspiegelt nicht ein bestimmtes Alter oder einen bestimmten Raumbereich. Sie widerspiegelt die Ewigkeit des materiellen Formwandels, die Unerschopflichkeit der Entwicklungsformen der Materie und ihrer raum-zeitlichen Beziehungen. Unendlichkeit der Materie bedeutet, daß sich jede endliche Entwicklungsform der materie im endlichen Raumbereich mit endlichem Alter bei ihre Umandlung wider in eine andere Entwicklungsform der Materie verwandelt, ebenfalls im endlichen Raumbereicht mit endlichen Alter".

Translation:

"The philosophical acknowledgement of the infiniteness of matter does not reflect a determined age or spatial extent. It denotes the eternity of material transformations, the [Unerschopflichkeit] (uncreatability?) of material forms and their timely/spatial inter-relations. Infinitness of matter means, that all development forms of matter in a finite space and finite time change in their transformation into a new development form of matter, which is also within finite time and spatial extents".

Nb. the translation is far from perfect, I hope I expressed the meaning correctly though

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Eh
Oh, I thought you meant an infinite quantity of matter.

Originally posted by Eh
Oh, I thought you meant an infinite quantity of matter.
The quantity of matter is not determinable, I think. Well scientificially said, there is only the possibility of determine it to be of finite extend, but a lack of proof for a finite amount of matter is no proof for an infinite amount of matter.

But you might be right that somewhere I have said that, it must have slipped from the keyboard.