Further Maths (Matrices and solving simultaneous equations)

AI Thread Summary
The discussion revolves around solving simultaneous equations using matrices and understanding the conditions for the existence of an inverse matrix. The participant successfully found the value of n as 21 but struggled with determining the inverse matrix A-1 and the conditions for k, concluding that k cannot equal 21 to avoid a zero determinant. They utilized Gaussian elimination to solve the equations but expressed uncertainty about using the inverse method due to difficulties in part (ii). The conversation highlights the importance of matrix representation for solving systems of equations and confirms that the matrix method is applicable in similar problems. Overall, the participants emphasized the interconnectedness of the parts in the problem-solving process.
olee
Messages
24
Reaction score
0

Homework Statement


2ibnlzt.png

FP1 (MEI June 07)


Homework Equations





The Attempt at a Solution


(i) Find the value of n
I multiplied the top row of A by the left column of B and got the equation:
-5-16+k=k-n
moved stuff around and ended up with n=21

(ii)Write down the inverse matrix A-1 and write down the conditions on k for this to exist.
Well, I know that k can not be 21 otherwise the determinant will be 0 which cannot be true in this circumstance.
I'm not too sure how to do A-1. I know that the matrix itself must be what B originally was, but I'm not sure how to find out what k is (and thus the determinant).

(iii)Using the result from part (ii), or otherwise, solve the following simultaneous equations.

x-2y+z=1
2x+2y+z=12
3x+2y-z=3


I solved this using Gaussian elimination. I know how to solve this using the inverse of matrices, but I couldn't quite do part (ii) so i was unable to use that method.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
olee said:
(ii)Write down the inverse matrix A-1 and write down the conditions on k for this to exist.
Well, I know that k can not be 21 otherwise the determinant will be 0 which cannot be true in this circumstance.
I'm not too sure how to do A-1. I know that the matrix itself must be what B originally was, but I'm not sure how to find out what k is (and thus the determinant).

Well you know that det(A)≠ 0, so you can find the condition for k using the determinant. (This will directly show you why k≠ 21)

Otherwise if k=n, then wouldn't AB=0, meaning that either A or B is the zero matrix?

Thus I think you should write A-1 in terms of k

olee said:
(iii)Using the result from part (ii), or otherwise, solve the following simultaneous equations.

x-2y+z=1
2x+2y+z=12
3x+2y-z=3


I solved this using Gaussian elimination. I know how to solve this using the inverse of matrices, but I couldn't quite do part (ii) so i was unable to use that method.

If you put the equations into the form CX=D, the matrix C would look similar to A wouldn't it?

and since AB=constant*I

what does that say about A and B?
 
rock.freak667 said:
Well you know that det(A)≠ 0, so you can find the condition for k using the determinant. (This will directly show you why k≠ 21)

Otherwise if k=n, then wouldn't AB=0, meaning that either A or B is the zero matrix?

Thus I think you should write A-1 in terms of k



If you put the equations into the form CX=D, the matrix C would look similar to A wouldn't it?

and since AB=constant*I

what does that say about A and B?

Thanks for the reply.

I've decided to do this for part (ii)


k2fr7s.png


i'm unsure on how to solve for k in order to do part (iii) without Gaussian methods.
 
olee said:
Thanks for the reply.

I've decided to do this for part (ii)
k2fr7s.png


i'm unsure on how to solve for k in order to do part (iii) without Gaussian methods.

Well look at the system of equations

x-2y+z=1
2x+2y+z=12
3x+2y-z=3

if you write this in a matrix form, what would it be?

(Compare the 3x3 matrix to the matrix A)
 
Last edited:
rock.freak667 said:
Well look at the system of equations

x-2y+z=1
2x+2y+z=12
3x+2y-z=3

if you write this in a matrix form, what would it be?

(Compare the 3x3 matrix to the matrix A)

like this

j7spib.png
 
olee said:
like this

no no just put these equations

x-2y+z=1
2x+2y+z=12
3x+2y-z=3

in a matrix form. Forget about the previous parts from before. What does the system look like in a matrix form?
 
rock.freak667 said:
no no just put these equations

x-2y+z=1
2x+2y+z=12
3x+2y-z=3

in a matrix form. Forget about the previous parts from before. What does the system look like in a matrix form?

2yts7bl.png


i think..
 
olee said:
i think..

Let's start simpler with 2 equations with 2 unknowns

x+y=1
2x+y=2

if we wanted to put this in a matrix form we'd get

\left(<br /> \begin{array}{cc}<br /> 1 &amp; 1\\<br /> 2 &amp; 1<br /> \end{array}<br /> \right) \left( \begin{array}{c} x \\ y \end{array} \right) = \left( \begin{array}{c} 1 \\ 2 \end{array} \right)


Essentially, in the matrix, on the left side, the top line is the coefficients of the first matrix. The second line, the coefficients of the second matrix.

On the right side matrix, the first line is what ever is on the right side of the equal sign and so on.


Can you do something similar for the given set of equations?
 
rock.freak667 said:
Let's start simpler with 2 equations with 2 unknowns

x+y=1
2x+y=2

if we wanted to put this in a matrix form we'd get

\left(<br /> \begin{array}{cc}<br /> 1 &amp; 1\\<br /> 2 &amp; 1<br /> \end{array}<br /> \right) \left( \begin{array}{c} x \\ y \end{array} \right) = \left( \begin{array}{c} 1 \\ 2 \end{array} \right)


Essentially, in the matrix, on the left side, the top line is the coefficients of the first matrix. The second line, the coefficients of the second matrix.

On the right side matrix, the first line is what ever is on the right side of the equal sign and so on.


Can you do something similar for the given set of equations?

11toowm.png
 
  • #10
olee said:
11toowm.png

your second column should be -2,1,2

Check the original question, you typed it incorrectly and I quoted you so you used the wrong equations. Re-do it and then compare the 3x3 matrix to the matrix A.
 
  • #11
rock.freak667 said:
your second column should be -2,1,2

Check the original question, you typed it incorrectly and I quoted you so you used the wrong equations. Re-do it and then compare the 3x3 matrix to the matrix A.

30lnfc1.png


.: k=1

thanks!

but i was wondering, is this method true with all matrix questions like this? or is it specific to this one?
 
  • #12
olee said:
.: k=1

thanks!

but i was wondering, is this method true with all matrix questions like this? or is it specific to this one?

In these types of exams usually in Further math, if the questions have i,ii,iii,... in them, they are usually linked.

If you are asking if the matrix method can be used to solve a system of equations, then yes.
 
  • #13
thanks mate! i appreciate it!
 
Back
Top