Gravitomagnetism: Derivation, Theory & Insights - Bill

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of gravitomagnetism, its derivation, and theoretical implications, particularly in relation to Maxwell's equations and general relativity. Participants explore the limitations of gravitomagnetic equations and seek literature that connects gravitomagnetism to general relativity.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant shares a derivation of Maxwell's equations from Coulomb's Law and special relativity, noting its application to gravity and the resulting gravitomagnetic equations, which are claimed to lack relativistic invariance.
  • Another participant agrees that the source of gravitomagnetism differs from that in electromagnetism, highlighting that it is a tensor rather than a 4-vector.
  • A participant suggests that there may be literature connecting gravitomagnetic theory to a limiting case of general relativity, referencing a specific paper as a potential resource.
  • Concerns are raised about the limitations of certain derivations, with a participant noting that a Loedel-type diagram may not be as comprehensive as a Minkowski diagram for analyzing gravitomagnetism.
  • Another participant mentions Feynman's lectures on gravitation as a valuable alternative perspective on fundamental physics, although it does not directly address gravitomagnetism.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the implications and limitations of gravitomagnetism, with no consensus reached on its relationship to general relativity or the validity of specific derivations.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge that the gravitomagnetic equations are not relativistically invariant and that the source of gravitomagnetism is fundamentally different from that of electromagnetism, which may affect interpretations and applications.

bhobba
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I often post a derivation of Maxwell's equations from Coulomb's Law and SR:
http://cse.secs.oakland.edu/haskell/Special Relativity and Maxwells Equations.pdf

The author has also published book about it, I sort of on a whim purchased:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/1516864743/?tag=pfamazon01-20

In it he also applied the same derivation to gravity, and not surprisingly ends up with the Gravitomagnetic equations. They are, unlike Maxwell's equations, not relativistically invariant, nor do they take into account gravity gravitates that Peter Donis wrote excellent insight articles about:
https://www.physicsforums.com/insights/does-gravity-gravitate/

It must fail because unlike electric charge mass 'charges' are not invariant as it forms part of the stress energy tensor.

My query is does anyone know any literature about the gravitomagnetic theory being some kind f limiting case of GR, like linearised gravity is?

Thanks
Bill
 
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bhobba said:
They are, unlike Maxwell's equations, not relativistically invariant

Yes, that's because the source, unlike in the Maxwell case, is not a 4-vector, but a tensor.

bhobba said:
does anyone know any literature about the gravitomagnetic theory being some kind f limiting case of GR, like linearised gravity is?

Section 1.2 of this paper might be the sort of thing you are looking for:

https://arxiv.org/pdf/gr-qc/0311030.pdf
 
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bhobba said:
I often post a derivation of Maxwell's equations from Coulomb's Law and SR:
http://cse.secs.oakland.edu/haskell/Special Relativity and Maxwells Equations.pdf
Hmm... Haskell appears to use a Loedel-type diagram and analysis, which works for special cases... but is limited, compared to a Minkowski diagram and its methods.

On gravitomagnetism,
this ancient thread (my post and the rest of thread) might be of interest.
https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/there-is-no-gravitational-dipole.80710/#post-691492
https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/gravitomagnetism-and-gr.54932/
 
It's not about gravitomagnetism, but as usual Feynman is a very good read to get an alternative view on fundamental physics:

R. P. Feynman, Feynman lectures on gravitation,
Addison-Wesley, Reading, Massachusetts (1996).
 
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