Harmonic oscillator in a heat bath

AI Thread Summary
The discussion focuses on modeling a harmonic oscillator in a heat bath at a fixed temperature T, highlighting the challenges of mixing classical and statistical mechanics. The initial approach suggests that the oscillator's frequency should be significantly higher than the interaction frequency with the heat bath, allowing for the identification of energy states with elliptical trajectories. A key issue arises in determining the correct probability measure for these trajectories, as the proposed Boltzmann measure does not accurately reflect the density of the trajectories. The conversation also touches on the generalization of the Boltzmann probability measure to arbitrary measure spaces, questioning how to define the measure effectively. Ultimately, the participants seek clarity on deriving the correct measure and its implications for the partition function.
jostpuur
Messages
2,112
Reaction score
19
How to describe a harmonic oscillator defined by

<br /> H(q,p) = \frac{p^2}{2m} + \frac{1}{2}kq^2<br />

in a heat bath with some fixed temperature T?

I suppose this question alone is not quite well defined, because it mixes classical and statistical mechanics in confusing manner, but I thought that one could make the question more rigor by assuming, that the oscillator frequency is notably larger than the frequency of instants when the oscillator interacts with the heat bath. In this case we could identify the ellipse trajectories q^2 + \frac{1}{mk}p^2 = r^2 with the indexes of the energy states used in statistical treatment. Right? The trajectories, on the other hand, can be identified with the radius r\in [0,\infty[. The energy corresponding to each radius is E(r) = \frac{1}{2}kr^2.

The problem is that if we set the Boltzmann probability measure to be proportional to

<br /> \exp\Big(-\frac{kr^2}{2k_{\textrm{B}} T}\Big) dr,<br />

it would not give the correct energy distribution. This is, because this formula doesn't correctly take into account the density of the ellipse trajectories. The correct probability measure should be something like this:

<br /> \exp\Big(-\frac{kr^2}{2k_{\textrm{B}} T}\Big) \rho(r) dr,<br />

but I've been unable to figure out what \rho(r) should be.

I thought that this could be a good postulate to start with: When the oscillator interacts with the heat bath, the position q remains unchanged, but the momentum p becomes thrown to some arbitrary new value, so that the probability of the new momentum would not be weighted by any particular density function. This would be a model of a collision with some particle from the heat bath. So if we assume that the new momentum has a probability measure proportional to dp (this is not normalizable really, but it shouldn't be a problem, because normalizable factors arise later), it should be possible to solve what measure \rho(r)dr follows for the trajectories.

Unfortunately I found this task too difficult. Anyone having any comments to this? Did I start into wrong direction with this problem, or can the \rho(r) be solved from what I started?
 
Last edited:
Science news on Phys.org
Maybe you could start by calculating the canonical partition function
<br /> Z(T)= \frac{1}{{(2\pi\hbar)}^3} \int d^3 p d^3 r e^{(-H/T)}\;.<br />
 
I suppose that would be

<br /> Z(T) = \int\limits_{\mathbb{R}^2} dp\; dq\; \exp\Big(-\frac{H(q,p)}{k_{\textrm{B}} T}\Big)<br />

with the notation I was using?

That doesn't look right. It assumes that the points in the phase space would be the indexes of the energy states, and ignores the assumption I made in the beginning, that the indexes of the energy states should be the ellipse trajectories.

Once the \rho(r), I talked about in the first post, becomes known, then the partition function would be given by formula

<br /> Z(T) = \int\limits_0^{\infty} dr\; \rho(r) \exp\Big(-\frac{kr^2}{2k_{\textrm{B}} T}\Big)<br />
 
Having written down those two equations, it seems immediately clear, that there exists such \rho(r) that the Z(T) is identical from the both formulas, but I'm not convinced that such \rho(r) would be consistent with the earlier assumption

jostpuur said:
I thought that this could be a good postulate to start with: When the oscillator interacts with the heat bath, the position q remains unchanged, but the momentum p becomes thrown to some arbitrary new value, so that the probability of the new momentum would not be weighted by any particular density function.
 
Problem of underlying measure space

I've understood that if \Omega is some finite index set of the energy states, then the Boltzmann probability measure is given by formula

<br /> P_T(\{\sigma\}) = \frac{\exp\big(-\frac{H(\sigma)}{k_{\textrm{B}} T}\big)}<br /> {\underset{\sigma&#039;\in\Omega}{\sum} \exp\big(-\frac{H(\sigma&#039;)}{k_{\textrm{B}} T}\big)}.<br />

If, instead of a finite index set, we have some arbitrary measure space (\Omega,\mu) as the index set, then the formula becomes naturally generalized as

<br /> P_T(X)= \frac{\underset{X}{\int} d\mu(\sigma) \exp\big(-\frac{H(\sigma)}{k_{\textrm{B}} T}\big)}<br /> {\underset{\Omega}{\int} d\mu(\sigma&#039;) \exp\big(-\frac{H(\sigma&#039;)}{k_{\textrm{B}} T}\big)}.<br />

The problem is that usually physical arguments will only tell what \Omega is, and \mu is left as a mystery. I'm curious to know if there exists some established theory on how \mu should be solved in general.

I've noticed that some times \mu can be solved by taking the most natural measure and not worrying about it more. For example with a gas molecule the index set is \mathbb{R}^3, and indexes are the possible velocities v of the molecule. It turns out that the correct Maxwell-Boltzmann velocity distribution follows if one chooses to use the standard Lebesgue measure m_3 (or d^3x).

Is there enlightening explanations out there, about why precisely the standard measure m_3 works so well?

The example I gave in the first post is an example of a more difficult situation, where the measure is not so obviously guessable.
 
I need to calculate the amount of water condensed from a DX cooling coil per hour given the size of the expansion coil (the total condensing surface area), the incoming air temperature, the amount of air flow from the fan, the BTU capacity of the compressor and the incoming air humidity. There are lots of condenser calculators around but they all need the air flow and incoming and outgoing humidity and then give a total volume of condensed water but I need more than that. The size of the...
I was watching a Khan Academy video on entropy called: Reconciling thermodynamic and state definitions of entropy. So in the video it says: Let's say I have a container. And in that container, I have gas particles and they're bouncing around like gas particles tend to do, creating some pressure on the container of a certain volume. And let's say I have n particles. Now, each of these particles could be in x different states. Now, if each of them can be in x different states, how many total...
Thread 'Why work is PdV and not (P+dP)dV in an isothermal process?'
Let's say we have a cylinder of volume V1 with a frictionless movable piston and some gas trapped inside with pressure P1 and temperature T1. On top of the piston lay some small pebbles that add weight and essentially create the pressure P1. Also the system is inside a reservoir of water that keeps its temperature constant at T1. The system is in equilibrium at V1, P1, T1. Now let's say i put another very small pebble on top of the piston (0,00001kg) and after some seconds the system...
Back
Top