Help finding propeller thrust.

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    Propeller Thrust
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating propeller thrust for a truss analysis project related to aircraft. Participants explore the necessary variables and equations needed to achieve static equilibrium, particularly focusing on mass airflow and slipstream velocity in relation to the aircraft's speed.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant states a formula for thrust involving mass airflow and the difference between slipstream velocity and aircraft velocity, but expresses uncertainty about calculating mass airflow and slipstream velocity with the given data.
  • Another participant suggests that thrust will be roughly equal to the aircraft's drag, contingent on certain assumptions, and indicates that thrust calculation may not be feasible with the current information.
  • A different participant proposes looking up the top speed of a specific aircraft powered by the same engine to estimate the thrust needed, assuming a certain propeller efficiency.
  • One participant critiques the thrust equation provided, likening it to rocket thrust equations, and suggests that it may not be useful without prior thrust calculations. They recommend searching for a thrust calculator that considers propeller characteristics and aircraft speed.
  • Another participant provides links to thrust calculators specifically for moving aircraft, noting that many available calculators focus on static thrust.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the feasibility of calculating thrust with the available data, and there is no consensus on the best approach or the utility of the thrust equation discussed.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge limitations in the available data, including assumptions about propeller efficiency and the need for additional information to accurately calculate thrust.

unethikal
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Hello, I am working on a project regarding truss analysis on a plane and I need to find all the forces acting on the truss in order to produce static equilibrium (note that I have not yet taken fluid mechanics and I wanted a challenge).

From what I have found, propeller thrust is:

Thrust = Mass airflow X (slipstream velocity-aircraft velocity).

The aircraft is moving at a true airspeed of 120km/h. Do you guys have any idea how to calculate mass airflow and slipstream velocity with these variables? The propeller being used is this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bristol_Pegasus

Thank you.
 
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The short answer is that thrust will be roughly equal to the aircrafts drag (some asumptions have to be made). Google the four forces of flight.

I don't think you can calculate thrust from the data you have. I suppose you could have a stab at calculating the thrust if you knew how much power was required to go at 120km/h and made some assumptions about prop efficiency.
 
PS You could look up data for the top speed of a Vickers Wellington powered by two of those engines. Knowing the power and that the prop might be say 80% efficient you could take a stab at the thrust needed to fly at that top speed.
 
unethikal said:
From what I have found, propeller thrust is:
Thrust = Mass airflow X (slipstream velocity-aircraft velocity).
That's similar to the equation for rocket thrust. The term "exit velocity" is used to describe the velocity of the affected air at the moment its pressure returns to ambient. Nasa article:

propeller_analysis.htm

This thrust equation isn't very useful, since it's essentially just two ways of expressing thrust after you've already calculated what the thrust is.

What you want is a "thrust calculator" that uses propeller characteristics (blade shape, blade size, number of blades), rpm, and aircraft speed. You can try a web search for thrust calculator, but most of these will be for "static" thrust, where the aircraft is not moving. You can also try searcing for "blade element theory", which will provide more mathematical based articles. Here is one web article that goes through the math, but I don't know if it will provide the answer you're looking for, or how accurate it is (not sure if it takes into account the induced flow effect on a prop with more than 2 blades):

prop1.htm

You may be able to find other and more useful articles.
 
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