Help needed for this question - Air pressure in a bike tire

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the air pressure and density in a bike tire, based on a given gauge pressure, temperature, and gas constant. It includes aspects of thermodynamics and gas laws, focusing on homework-related problem-solving.

Discussion Character

  • Homework-related
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that the pressure gauge reads gauge pressure and questions what the actual pressure is, suggesting the need to consider atmospheric pressure.
  • Another participant discusses constructing the state equation for the gas in the tire and clarifies that density is mass per unit volume, indicating that knowing the density will help in calculating the mass for part (b) of the problem.
  • There is a suggestion to rewrite the ideal gas law equation in terms of density, with one participant expressing confusion about the relationship between pressure, density, and temperature.
  • One participant emphasizes the difference between gauge pressure and actual pressure, stating that the gauge measures the difference between the internal and external pressures.
  • A participant expresses difficulty in understanding the equations and suggests that the actual pressure might be 7 bar, although this is not confirmed by others.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the need to account for atmospheric pressure when determining actual pressure, but there is no consensus on the specific calculations or the interpretation of the equations involved. Confusion remains regarding the application of the ideal gas law and the role of density.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved assumptions regarding the definitions of pressure and density, as well as the application of the ideal gas law in this context. The discussion includes various interpretations of the equations and their components.

Who May Find This Useful

Students studying thermodynamics or gas laws, particularly those working on homework related to pressure and density calculations in gases.

andyb1990
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Help needed for this question -- Air pressure in a bike tire

Homework Statement


The Pressure gauge on a bike pump reads 8 bar at sea level on a day when the temperature is 21°C. Assume that the gas constant for air is 286.9 J/Kg K

a) What is the density of the air in the tyre?

b) What is the weight of the air in the tyre, if the diameter of the wheel is 0.66m and the diameter of the inner tube is 4cm
Help would be greatly appreciated

also in SI units please :)

Homework Equations


The Attempt at a Solution


pv=mRT

p= 8bar
R= 286.9
T= 273+21 294

m=?

equation V=mRT/P?
 
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Some notes:
The pressure in the tire is the gauge pressure ... what is the actual pressure?
You can construct the state equation for the gas in the tire OK?
Density is mass-per-unit-volume, though you can have a molar density as the number of moles per unit volume ... that would be (m/V) right?
... that should take care of part (a) ... having got the density, you should be able to get the mass from the volume for part (b).
 


so the pressure will be...

(Pgage = ρgh??) + (pressure of atmosphere 101325pa * temp 21°)
 


andyb1990 said:
so the pressure will be...

(Pgage = ρgh??) + (pressure of atmosphere 101325pa * temp 21°)

1. p ~ 8 + 1 = 9 bar. What's with "ρgh"??

I suppose you can be more precise & include T effect.

2. You said pV = mRT, so rewrite this substituting density ρ. I would not mess with moles, no need and no point.

3. Rest is straightforward.
 


The rude man is correct - a tire gauge compares the pressure of the atmosphere outside the tire with the pressure of the air inside it... reading out the difference. So:P_{gauge}=P_{actual}-P_{atmos}

Keep going... :)
 


so the equation including density would look likeP=ρ(R/M)Tsorry I just can't get my head around it! :(

and the actual pressure would be 7bar?
 

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