How do atoms affect thermodynamics?

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    Atoms Thermodynamics
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the influence of atoms on thermodynamic variables, exploring both general and specific effects. Participants examine how atomic behavior relates to temperature and other thermodynamic properties, considering both scalar and vectorial impacts.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Technical explanation, Conceptual clarification, Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that while thermodynamics existed before the acceptance of atomic theory, they seek to understand how atoms specifically influence thermodynamic variables in everyday examples.
  • Another participant asserts that since temperature is linked to the energy of moving atoms, it can be concluded that atoms influence all thermodynamic variables.
  • A participant expresses interest in understanding atomic effects that are not scalar, but rather vectorial, indicating a desire to explore localized temperature changes rather than uniform ones.
  • One reply clarifies that temperature relates to the average energy of many particles, suggesting that for a small number of atoms, concepts like kinetic energy and momentum, which have directional properties, may be more applicable.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of atomic influence on thermodynamics, with some asserting a broad influence on all variables and others questioning the applicability of temperature at the atomic level. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the specifics of vectorial effects.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the discussion regarding the definitions of temperature and momentum, as well as the assumptions made about the applicability of thermodynamic concepts to single or few atoms.

lucas_
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There was a time when they didn't believe in atoms. But thermodynamics and temperature still existed and applied. What are the ways that atoms can influence thermodynamics? I can only think of one now where the temperature of the nuclear warhead suddenly increased million folds due to the chain reaction and thermonuclear explosion. But what daily example where atoms can influence any thermodynamic variables?
 
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Since temperature is due to the energy of moving atoms, and the speed that atoms are moving depends on their mass and how much kinetic energy they have, it's safe to say that atoms influence ALL thermodynamic variables. Try this Google search:
https://www.google.com/search?&q=speed+of+atoms+vs+temperature
 
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Tom.G said:
Since temperature is due to the energy of moving atoms, and the speed that atoms are moving depends on their mass and how much kinetic energy they have, it's safe to say that atoms influence ALL thermodynamic variables. Try this Google search:
https://www.google.com/search?&q=speed+of+atoms+vs+temperature

Ok. But I want to know effects where it's not scalar (affecting temperature all over), but vectorial, where only certain regions are affected.
 
lucas_ said:
Ok. But I want to know effects where it's not scalar (affecting temperature all over), but vectorial, where only certain regions are affected.
I don't know what that means.

But you should understand that temperature is a thermodynamic quantity related to the average energy of a large number of particles. If we look at only 1 or 2 particles (atoms), the concept of temperature does not apply, but kinetic energy, and momentum do apply. Momentum has direction and is "vectorial".

See this article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temperature#Kinetic_theory_approach
 

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