How to integrate this function?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the integration of a differential equation represented as $$xy'' = y' + (y')^{3}$$, with participants exploring various methods of integration and substitution. The subject area includes differential equations and integration techniques.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Mathematical reasoning, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the transformation of the original equation into a form involving $$p$$, where $$y' = p$$. There are attempts to integrate using different methods, including u-substitution and partial fractions. Some participants question the appropriateness of certain substitutions and suggest alternative approaches.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active with multiple participants providing insights and suggestions. Some participants express uncertainty about the correctness of their approaches, while others offer guidance on integration techniques. There is a recognition of minor errors in the reasoning, but no consensus has been reached regarding the final integration steps.

Contextual Notes

Participants are working within the constraints of homework rules, which may limit the amount of direct assistance they can provide. There are ongoing discussions about the validity of various substitution methods and the implications of those choices on the integration process.

vanceEE
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Homework Statement


$$xy'' = y' + (y')^{3}$$

Homework Equations


$$ y'' = p' = \frac{dp}{dx}$$
$$ y' = p$$

The Attempt at a Solution


$$xy'' = y' + (y')^{3}$$
$$ x*\frac{dp}{dx} = p + p^{3} $$
$$ \frac{dx}{x} = \frac{dp}{p+p^3} $$
$$ ln x + C = ∫\frac{dp}{p(1+p^2)} $$
$$ u = p^{2} $$ $$du = 2p dp$$
$$ ln x + C = ∫\frac{1}{p(1+p^2)}*\frac{du}{2p} $$
$$ ln x + C = ∫\frac{du}{2p^2(1+p^2)} $$
$$ ln x + C = ∫\frac{du}{2u(1+u)} $$
$$ln x + C = \frac{1}{2}∫\frac{du}{u} - \frac{1}{2}∫\frac{du}{1+u} $$
$$ln x + C = \frac{1}{2}ln (\frac{p^2}{p^2+1}) $$
$$ Dx^2 = \frac{p^2}{p^2+1} $$
$$ p^2 = \frac{Dx^2}{1-Dx^2} $$
$$ y' = \frac{√(Dx^2)}{√(1-Dx^2)} $$

How do I integrate $$ y' = \frac{√(Dx^2)}{√(1-Dx^2)} ?$$
 
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vanceEE said:

Homework Statement


$$xy'' = y' + (y')^{3}$$


Homework Equations


$$ y'' = p' = \frac{dp}{dx}$$
$$ y' = p$$



The Attempt at a Solution


$$xy'' = y' + (y')^{3}$$
$$ x*\frac{dp}{dx} = p + p^{3} $$
$$ \frac{dx}{x} = \frac{dp}{p+p^3} $$
$$ ln x + C = ∫\frac{dp}{p(1+p^2)} $$
$$ u = p^{2} $$ $$du = 2p dp$$

You don't want a u substitution here. Try partial fractions$$
\frac 1 {p(1+p^2)}=\frac A p + \frac {Bp+C}{1+p^2}$$
 
LCKurtz said:
You don't want a u substitution here. Try partial fractions$$
\frac 1 {p(1+p^2)}=\frac A p + \frac {Bp+C}{1+p^2}$$

I used partial fractions after u-substitution.
$$ ∫\frac{dx}{x} = ∫\frac{du}{2u(1+u)} $$
$$ \frac{A}{2u} + \frac{B}{1+u} = \frac{1}{2u(1+u)} $$
$$ A(1+u) + B(2u) = 1 $$
$$ A = 1 $$ and $$ B = -\frac{1}{2} $$
$$ ∫\frac{dx}{x} = ∫\frac{du}{2u} - \frac{1}{2}∫\frac{du}{1+u} $$
$$ ∫\frac{dx}{x} = \frac{1}{2} ∫ \frac{du}{u} - \frac{1}{2} ∫ \frac{du}{1+u} $$
$$ ln x + C = \frac{1}{2} ln(p^2) -\frac{1}{2}ln(p^2+1) $$
Therefore, $$ Dx^2 = \frac{p^2}{p^2+1} $$
Since $$ ∫\frac{du}{2u(1+u)} \equiv∫\frac{dp}{p(1+p^2)}$$
$$ du = 2p dp → u = p^2 $$
$$\frac{du}{2u(1+u)} \equiv \frac{2pdp}{2p^2(1+p^2)} \equiv \frac{dp}{p(1+p^2)} $$
 
Last edited:
Can someone show me the steps to integrating $$ \frac{dy}{dx} = \frac{√(Dx^2)}{√(1-Dx^2)} ?$$
Attempt:
$$ \frac{dy}{dx} = \frac{√(Dx^2)}{√(1-Dx^2)} $$
$$ dy = \frac{√(Dx^2)}{√(1-Dx^2)} dx$$
$$ y = ∫\frac{√(D)x}{√(1-Dx^2)} dx $$
Should I integrate by parts?
 
Last edited:
Is this correct?
$$ \frac{dy}{dx} = \frac{√(Dx^2)}{√(1-Dx^2)} $$
$$ dy = \frac{√(Dx^2)}{√(1-Dx^2)} dx$$
$$ y = ∫\frac{√(D)x}{√(1-Dx^2)} dx $$
$$ y = √(D)∫\frac{x}{√(1-Dx^2)} dx $$
$$ u = 1-Dx^2 $$
$$ du = -2Dx $$
$$ y = -\frac{1}{2√(D)}∫\frac{du}{√(u)} $$
$$ y = -\frac{1}{2√(D)}* 2√(u) + E $$
$$ y = -\frac{1}{2√(D)}* 2√(1-Dx^2) + E $$
$$ y = E -\frac{2√(1-Dx^2)}{2√(D)} $$
$$ y = E -\frac{√(1-Dx^2)}{√(D)} $$
 
Last edited:
vanceEE said:
Can someone show me the steps to integrating $$ \frac{dy}{dx} = \frac{√(Dx^2)}{√(1-Dx^2)} ?$$
How about x = Bsin(θ) for some suitable B?
 
vanceEE said:
Is this correct?
$$ \frac{dy}{dx} = \frac{√(Dx^2)}{√(1-Dx^2)} $$
$$ dy = \frac{√(Dx^2)}{√(1-Dx^2)} dx$$
$$ y = ∫\frac{√(D)x}{√(1-Dx^2)} dx $$
$$ y = √(D)∫\frac{x}{√(1-Dx^2)} dx $$
$$ u = 1-Dx^2 $$
$$ du = -2Dx $$
The above should be du = -2Dx dx.
vanceEE said:
$$ y = -\frac{1}{2√(D)}∫\frac{du}{√(u)} $$
$$ y = -\frac{1}{2√(D)}* 2√(u) + E $$
$$ y = -\frac{1}{2√(D)}* 2√(1-Dx^2) + E $$
$$ y = E -\frac{2√(1-Dx^2)}{2√(D)} $$
$$ y = E -\frac{√(1-Dx^2)}{√(D)} $$
Because of the factor of x in the numerator, an ordinary substitution works here. Other than the minor error I pointed out, I don't see anything else wrong, but I didn't check that closely. At this point, you can verify that your work is correct by differentiating to verify that your solution satisifies the differential equation. You don't need us to do that for you.
 
vanceEE said:
Is this correct?
$$ \frac{dy}{dx} = \frac{√(Dx^2)}{√(1-Dx^2)} $$
$$ dy = \frac{√(Dx^2)}{√(1-Dx^2)} dx$$
$$ y = ∫\frac{√(D)x}{√(1-Dx^2)} dx $$
$$ y = √(D)∫\frac{x}{√(1-Dx^2)} dx $$
$$ u = 1-Dx^2 $$
$$ du = -2Dx $$
The above should be du = -2Dx dx.
vanceEE said:
$$ y = -\frac{1}{2√(D)}∫\frac{du}{√(u)} $$
$$ y = -\frac{1}{2√(D)}* 2√(u) + E $$
$$ y = -\frac{1}{2√(D)}* 2√(1-Dx^2) + E $$
$$ y = E -\frac{2√(1-Dx^2)}{2√(D)} $$
$$ y = E -\frac{√(1-Dx^2)}{√(D)} $$
Because of the factor of x in the numerator, an ordinary substitution works here. Other than the minor error I pointed out, I don't see anything else wrong, but I didn't check that closely. At this point, you can verify that your work is correct by differentiating to verify that your solution satisifies the differential equation. You don't need us to do that for you.
 
Mark44 said:
The above should be du = -2Dx dx

Thank you for pointing this out for me Mark44 :-)
 

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