Inertial reference frame for 2&3 law

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the applicability of inertial reference frames to Newton's 2nd and 3rd laws of motion. Participants explore the relationship between these laws and the concept of inertial frames, considering both theoretical and conceptual implications.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that the 2nd and 3rd laws are only valid in inertial frames, with the first law providing the necessary context for understanding these laws.
  • One participant questions whether the 2nd law can apply in non-inertial frames, suggesting that since it involves acceleration, it might be applicable outside of inertial frames.
  • Another participant argues against the idea that the 2nd law subsumes the first, emphasizing the importance of the first law as foundational and distinct.
  • It is noted that fictitious forces must be introduced to apply the 2nd law in non-inertial frames, indicating a complexity in the application of these laws outside of inertial contexts.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the applicability of the 2nd law in non-inertial frames, with some insisting it is limited to inertial frames while others propose alternative interpretations.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved assumptions regarding the definitions of inertial and non-inertial frames, as well as the implications of fictitious forces in the context of Newton's laws.

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Does the concept of Inertial reference frame also applicable for 2nd & 3rd law of motion?
 
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The 2nd and 3rd laws are only valid in inertial frames. One way to look at the first law is that it establishes the context for the 2nd law. The first law defines the concept of an inertial frame and defines the concept of momentum. The second law is also more definition than law; it defines the concept of force. The third law is a true scientific law.
 
D H said:
The 2nd and 3rd laws are only valid in inertial frames. One way to look at the first law is that it establishes the context for the 2nd law. The first law defines the concept of an inertial frame and defines the concept of momentum. The second law is also more definition than law; it defines the concept of force. The third law is a true scientific law.

since 2nd law contain the term of acceleration & inertial frame consider the constant velocity or non-accelerated approach.
so i think 2nd law apply in non-inertial frame instead of inertial frame. am i right?? or wrong??
clear me.
thanks
 
That the second law subsumes the first is a common mistake. Look at it this way: Newton was a very smart guy. Not just the smartest of his time, but possibly the smartest person of all time. He felt the first law was essential, that it is something more than just a special case of the second law.

And no, the second law only applies in an inertial frame. Fictitious forces must be introduced to make the second law appear to apply in a non-inertial frame.
 

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