Interferance term, sum of 2 waves

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the interference of two complex wave fields, represented as \vec E _1 (\vec r , t) and \vec E _2 (\vec r , t). The original poster is tasked with demonstrating a specific expression for the interference term, I_{12}, involving the complex vectors of the electric fields.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to derive the interference term by summing the electric fields and squaring the resultant expression, but questions arise regarding the dependence on the angle of initial phase and the correct formulation of intensity. Some participants clarify the distinction between the intensity formula and the squared electric fields, while others reflect on the implications of complex vectors in this context.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively engaging with the problem, providing clarifications about the nature of complex electric fields and their implications for intensity calculations. There is a recognition of misunderstandings regarding the dependence of the electric fields on initial phase, and some participants are re-evaluating their approaches based on these insights.

Contextual Notes

There is an ongoing discussion about the correct interpretation of the intensity formula and the role of complex conjugates in the context of interference. Participants are also considering the implications of their assumptions about the wavefronts and initial phases.

fluidistic
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Homework Statement


Consider the following waves: [tex]\vec E _1 (\vec r , t) =\vec E_1 (\vec r) e^{-i \omega t}[/tex] and [tex]\vec E _2 (\vec r , t) =\vec E_2 (\vec r) e^{-i \omega t}[/tex] where the form of the wavefront isn't specified and where [tex]\vec E_1[/tex] and [tex]\vec E_2[/tex] are complex vectors which depend on spatial coordinates and the angle of the initial phase. Show that the term of interferance is given by [tex]I_{12}=\frac{1}{2} (\vec E _1 \cdot \vec E _2 ^* +\vec E _2 \cdot \vec E _1 ^*)[/tex]


Homework Equations



Not sure.

The Attempt at a Solution


Is it just me or the given E fields do NOT depend on the angle of initial phase?!
I took their E fields function, summed them up. It gave me [tex]e^{-i \omega t} [ \vec E _1 (\vec r ) + \vec E _2 (\vec r )][/tex].
Now if I remember well, the intensity of the resultant wave is proportional to the E field squared.
So I squared the expression I just wrote and I reached [tex]I_{12} = \alpha e^{-2i \omega t} [\vec E _1 ^2 (\vec r ) +\vec E _2 ^2 (\vec r ) +2 \vec E _1 (\vec r) \vec E _2 (\vec r ) ][/tex]. Now I guess the interference term is [tex]\alpha \vec E _1 (\vec r) \vec E _2[/tex] but it does not match the answer.
I realize that the given interference term is worth the sum of the product of the real parts and complex parts of [tex]\vec E _1[/tex] and [tex]\vec E _2[/tex] and precisely, this is not what happens in my answer.
Where did I go wrong?
 
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The intensity is given by [itex]I = \mathbf{E}^*\cdot\mathbf{E}[/itex]. It's not simply [itex]I=\mathbf{E}^2[/itex].
 
That's right. E is complex, so |E|2E2.
 
vela said:
That's right. E is complex, so |E|2E2.

Oh I see, thanks for the clarification!
 
vela said:
That's right. E is complex, so |E|2E2.

Sorry for bringing this back but I'm still missing something.
If I start from [tex]e^{-i \omega t} [ \vec E _1 (\vec r ) + \vec E _2 (\vec r )][/tex]. I can think of it as a complex number of the form [tex]re^{i \theta}[/tex], where [tex]r=\vec E _1 (\vec r ) + \vec E _2 (\vec r )[/tex] and [tex]\theta =-\omega t[/tex].
Then the modulus of E is r. And the modulus squared is [tex]r^2[/tex].
Now I'll get something of the form [tex]I_{12} = \alpha [\vec E _1 ^2 (\vec r ) +\vec E _2 ^2 (\vec r ) +2 \vec E _1 (\vec r) \vec E _2 (\vec r ) ][/tex] and I still have no trace of a complex conjugate... Hmm I'll try to continue in this way. If you have any comment, feel free to share knowledge. :smile:
 
From your first post
fluidistic said:
where [tex]\vec E_1[/tex] and [tex]\vec E_2[/tex] are complex vectors
 
vela said:
From your first post
Ahhh, I misunderstood the question, sorry. I thought they meant [tex]\vec E _1 (\vec r , t)[/tex] and hence my question regarding the dependence on the angle of initial phase. The dependence was hidden inside [tex]\vec E _1[/tex]!
Ok I'll rethink the whole problem now.
Thanks once again for pointing that out.
 
I almost have it I think.
I reach, starting from and assuming that [tex]I=E E^*[/tex] that [tex]I=|\vec E _1 (\vec r ) |+|\vec E _2 (\vec r )|+\vec E _1 \cdot \vec E _2 ^* +\vec E _2 \cdot \vec E _1 ^*[/tex].

I realize that the term of interference is [tex]\vec E _1 \cdot \vec E _2 ^* +\vec E _2 \cdot \vec E _1 ^*[/tex], but is it well "demonstrated"?
I can argue that if one doesn't know about interference, he will just guess that the intensity at any point in space is the sum of the intensities of the 2 wave sources, namely [tex]|\vec E _1 (\vec r ) |+|\vec E _2 (\vec r )|[/tex]. While if he does the experience he will see the interference effect and that it can be mathematically described by the term [tex]\vec E _1 \cdot \vec E _2 ^* +\vec E _2 \cdot \vec E _1 ^*[/tex].
I wonder if I've solved well the problem. What do you say? I have not used the fact that [tex]\vec E _i[/tex], [tex]i=1,2[/tex] is dependent on the initial phase.
 

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