Undergrad Interpreting the Sine Integral in Physics

Click For Summary
The discussion centers on the interpretation of the sine and cosine integrals in physics, highlighting that both integrals are technically undefined as they do not converge. However, physicists often treat the cosine integral as converging to the delta function, δ(x), for practical applications. The conversation seeks a similar hand-wavy interpretation for the sine integral, leading to an unconventional result of π/(2x) when manipulating the sine function. This reflects the ongoing tension between mathematical rigor and physical intuition in interpreting these integrals. Ultimately, the discussion underscores the complexities and differing approaches between mathematicians and physicists regarding these integrals.
stevendaryl
Staff Emeritus
Science Advisor
Homework Helper
Insights Author
Messages
8,943
Reaction score
2,954
Properly speaking, since sin(x) and cos(x) don't go to zero as x \rightarrow \infty, the following integrals are undefined:

\int_0^{\infty} cos(kx) dk
\int_0^{\infty} sin(kx) dk

However, in the handwavy way of physicists, we can often pretend that the cosine integral "converges" to \delta(x), where \delta(x) is defined via:

\int dx \delta(x) f(x) = f(0)

This interpretation is sort-of justified because for nicely-behaved functions f, we can prove:

\int_{0}^{+\infty} dk (\int_{-\infty}^{+\infty} f(x) cos(kx) dx) = f(0)

If we blithely switch the order of integration, then we can write this as:

\int_{-\infty}^{+\infty} dx f(x) (\int_{0}^{+\infty} cos(kx) dk) = f(0)

which sort of justifies identifies the inner integral with \delta(x).

My question is: Is there a related, equally hand-wavy interpretation of the sine integral?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
stevendaryl said:
However, in the handwavy way of physicists, we can often pretend that the cosine integral "converges" to δ(x)δ(x)\delta(x), where δ(x)δ(x)\delta(x) is defined via:

how you can say that? we know the function oscillates!
 
drvrm said:
how you can say that? we know the function oscillates!

That's why the word "converges" is in scare-quotes. The integral doesn't converge. However, for certain purposes, we can often act as if it converges to the delta function. (And for certain purposes, we can act as if the delta function is actually a function).
 
Last edited:
drvrm said:
how you can say that? we know the function oscillates!
That's typical answer of Mathematicians a century ago !
 
stevendaryl said:
My question is: Is there a related, equally hand-wavy interpretation of the sine integral?
By substituting ##\sin(kx)=\cos(kx-\pi/2)## into the integral of sine and then use the substitution technique to compute the integral as well as the hand-wavy definition of the cosine integral, I got an extremely unintuitive answer of ##\pi/(2x)##.
 
JJacquelin said:
That's typical answer of Mathematicians a century ago !
And still the answer in the ongoing war between mathematicians and physicists!
 
  • Like
Likes blue_leaf77

Similar threads

  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K