Is Cheating in Class Assignments OK?

[caljuice]

So I have in-class assignment every week. The questions on it are some of the challenge questions in textbook. I found the complete solution online so I try to do all the questions before the class to get ready. Since I know the correct answer and everything before doing it in class, is it considered cheating?

 

[rewebster]

so, if you didn't find the solutions on line, what would you do?


(so, I would say, yes)

 

[lisab]

If I were in your situation, I'd bring it to the attention of your instructor that the answers are available online.

Then if the instructor doesn't change the assignment, it's ok (but a bit shady).

But if you don't tell about it, then I'd say yes that's cheating.

 

[magpies]

Nope not cheating. It's only cheating if it hurts you.

 

[Office_Shredder]

Do these count towards your final grade?

 

[mgb_phys]

And is this just the answer - so you have to work out the method and the online resource is just confirming your result, or is it a step-step worked example that you are just copying out?

 

[caljuice]

so, if you didn't find the solutions on line, what would you do?(so, I would say, yes)

I would still do the questions before class. I'd just have to pray I'm right.

Nope not cheating. It's only cheating if it hurts you.

I like this logic.

Do these count towards your final grade?

And you it counts towards my final grades.

And is this just the answer - so you have to work out the method and the online resource is just confirming your result, or is it a step-step worked example that you are just copying out?

It has most of the work, not just the answer. I'm not copying, I do the question all on my own. I can't whip out the solution manual during the class. I use it to double check my work. If I'm wrong i'll try again till I get it or use the solution manual to point me in the right direction.

 

[Dadface]

You are depriving yourself of the opportunity to practise questions under exam conditions and you are giving your instructors a false impression of your abilities.How is this going to help you, for example in your finals.Yes it is cheating and the main person you're cheating is yourself.

 

[magpies]

Ok so I see the problem... You are not sure your problems are right so that means you have not learned how to self check them. I would complain to your teacher that they need to teach the class how to self check problems. Then you will no longer need to worry about if you got it right or not.

 

[Proton Soup]

you should attempt the problems on your own first.

as for questions online, you can blame lazy teachers for much of this (assuming you think it's a problem). pearson et al. are making the lives of teachers easier by providing "test banks" for their texts. and even for the computer-generated ones where the variables are changed, the questions are basically the same, even if the outcome is different.

 

[Chi Meson]

Is this high school or college?

I can answer from the perspective of a high school teacher:

If you are actually working through the challenge problems of the textbook, all of them, on a regular basis, that would put you way ahead of 99% of the student body. Even if you are checking the solved problems online, you are giving yourself a lot of experience in all the variations of problem solving. More experience is better. If you can manage to recall the methods of solutions to any of the challenge problems, then I would give you (limited) credit.

But if you are in college, and especially 2nd year or up, I'd think that you are getting by with a loophole. If this is the case, then I agree with lisab.

Go to the instructor and ask him: "Did you know that all the solutions are posted online?"

He/she could say "Yes I do." And if he leaves it at that, you are free to go.

If he goes "They ARE? You're JOKING!NFW!" Then at least you score a point for honesty.

 

[Jerbearrrrrr]

Isn't this just like revising? Do you know exactly which problem will come up?
If, at the end of the day, you have to learn how to solve each problem...then the assignment is doing to you what it's meant to do anyway.

 

[shoehorn]

Here's a valuable lesson that applies far beyond this particular situation: it's cheating only if you get caught. The wisest course of action, particularly given that you've already handed in assignments based on solutions you've found online, is to keep your mouth shut.

I really see very little that's ethically questionable if you are using the solutions to help you understand the subject better. Of course, if you're just copying them verbatim and not putting any thought into what you're writing, then it'll come back to bite you in the *** come the examinations or if you're asked by your instructor why your solutions are identical to ones he's found online.

 

[Dickfore]

It's not cheating. Whatever was done before class does not matter. For all they know, you might have had that course before, but you hadn't been allowed to waive it off.

 

[DaveC426913]

it's cheating only if you get caught.

This is absolutely deplorable. Shame.


Character is who you are when no one is looking.

 

[shoehorn]

This is absolutely deplorable. Shame.

Deplorable? Don't be silly.

 

[magpies]

No I agree its absolutely deplorable.

 

[Proton Soup]

Deplorable? Don't be silly.

there are certainly times when it is preferable to keep your mouth shut

 

[DaveC426913]

No I agree its absolutely deplorable.

Not sure where you stand after your comment:

It's only cheating if it hurts you.

 

[lisab]

I'm honestly amazed at how many people are writing in saying it's not cheating. Wow.

And yes, "it's cheating only if you get caught" is truly a deplorable attitude.

 

[DaveC426913]

Deplorable? Don't be silly.

The whole world now knows that you cannot be left alone in their living room, for you will pilfer the silverware.

 

[magpies]

I ment cheating yourself. I guess I should say this all my posts are ment to be deeply philosophical on many levels.

 

[shoehorn]

The whole world now knows that you cannot be left alone in their living room, for you will pilfer the silverware.

Well, that would be more stealing than cheating, which, although equally subjective, is a different kettle of fish entirely.

 

[TheStatutoryApe]

It sounds like OP is just saying that he studies the material before class, checking his work against the answers he found online, and then is capable of completing the assignment on his own in class. Or maybe I am missing something. If that's the case I am not sure how that is cheating.

 

[DaveC426913]

Well, that would be more stealing than cheating, which, although equally subjective, is a different kettle of fish entirely.

Nope. A person that believes rules only apply when someone's looking is a person that believes rules only apply when someone's looking.

Philosophically, they have no internal moral compass and rely on others to police them.

 

[shoehorn]

Nope. A person that believes rules only apply when someone's looking is a person that believes rules only apply when someone's looking.

Philosophically, they have no internal moral compass and rely on others to police them.

Again, you're being silly. Indeed, now you're winking suggestively at outright idiocy.

 

[lisab]

Nope. A person that believes rules only apply when someone's looking is a person that believes rules only apply when someone's looking.

Philosophically, they have no internal moral compass and rely on others to police them.

ah...Dave when I read the post you quoted, my first two things in my head were, "Nope" and "no moral compass".

 

[magpies]

Actually the cheating kettle fish exists in the same lake as the stealing one.

 

[shoehorn]

I, for one, think there's great promise in these aquatic metaphors.

 

[Proton Soup]

It sounds like OP is just saying that he studies the material before class, checking his work against the answers he found online, and then is capable of completing the assignment on his own in class. Or maybe I am missing something. If that's the case I am not sure how that is cheating.

also, i think the primary motivation for this kind of weekly assignment is to keep students from getting behind in their studies.

 

[lisab]

It sounds like OP is just saying that he studies the material before class, checking his work against the answers he found online, and then is capable of completing the assignment on his own in class. Or maybe I am missing something. If that's the case I am not sure how that is cheating.

In matters of ethics, it's always best to err on the safe side. The OP should let the instructor know that the answers to the quizzes are available online.

 

[DaveC426913]

Again, you're being silly. Indeed, now you're winking suggestively at outright idiocy.

You can't possibly be serious.

Let me clarify, because there must be a misunderstanding.

It's only cheating if you get caught. i.e. if you do not get caught, you have done nothing wrong.

How widely do you spread this philosophy? Does it only apply to school studies?

 

[Moonbear]

If you are finding the solutions online, knowing you will have an in-class assignment asking to provide those solutions for your grade, then yes, it's cheating.

On the other hand, if the questions are always from the challenge problems in your book, then spending time working out the problems BY YOURSELF so you can do them faster on the in-class assignment is fine. Presumably, everyone else in the class has this same opportunity as well, and your teacher/professor may be using the in-class assignment a bit like a pop quiz to see if you're keeping up with your studying and doing practice problems at home.

 

[Jack21222]

I'd only worry about it if it negatively impacts your ability to do well on the exams. It reminds me of something my General Physics 1 professor said... Homework was 15% of our grade, and he admitted he knew that there were solutions for every problem posted online somewhere.

He then went on to say, and I'm paraphrasing, "I don't care if you just copy the solutions. It doesn't hurt me any. But if you do that, you're likely to get a 0 on my exams, and wind up with a 15% for the whole class."

 

[magpies]

I don't see why the Op has to tell the teacher... The teacher should know better then to give out homework that's so easy to do. In my exprience if he tells the teacher he will end up getting the blame for it by both the teacher and the class that is probably using the same site he is to "do" the homework. It's not really his responsiblity but I guess he could take it up and it might be fun to see the responces even if it comes at his expense.

 

[DaveC426913]

I'd only worry about it if it negatively impacts your ability to do well on the exams. It reminds me of something my General Physics 1 professor said... Homework was 15% of our grade, and he admitted he knew that there were solutions for every problem posted online somewhere.

He then went on to say, and I'm paraphrasing, "I don't care if you just copy the solutions. It doesn't hurt me any. But if you do that, you're likely to get a 0 on my exams, and wind up with a 15% for the whole class."

Note that the OP isn't asking whether it will hurt his marks (which is a pragmatic issue), he is asking if it is cheating (which is a moral issue).

Your reponse is tantamount to: don't worry about whether it's ethically wrong, since the practical damage is small.

 

[magpies]

I suppose I could share a story about my high schools math team? They were one of the top ranked math teams in the state I think. Anyhow they tryed to get me to join the club and I at that time not very good at math but a lot of people thought I was really smart so... Anyhow I was with a few of them in class and we was talking about how easy it is to cheat on class work ect I think something about the programable calcs we used?? Dont really remember the conv that well anyhow... So they bring up the fact that they all have a program that looks like the normal calc screen so that when teachers check to see if they have programs installed they just turn the program on and the teachers check the calc for programs and come up with none. So long story short they where using the calcs at math meets ect... So basicaly if they got asked a question all they had to do was find the program and execute. I while not very good at math at the time probably actually knew more then they did I bet even though I would not have been able to "answer" questions they could.

 

[shoehorn]

You can't possibly be serious.

No, I suggest you're the one who isn't entirely serious. For instance, you've already stated that I:

• have no moral compass;
• believe stealing is perfectly acceptable behaviour once one gets away with it;
• believe, in fact, that any proscribed behaviour whatsoever is acceptable in the absence of being caught.

I think we can agree that these are rather odd claims that you've made.

Let me clarify, because there must be a misunderstanding.

It's only cheating if you get caught. i.e. if you do not get caught, you have done nothing wrong.

In reference to the specific situation described by the OP, yes, I'd argue quite forcefully that for such a trivial matter as this, it can't reasonably be considered cheating. My opinion is that anyone who would argue that it was cheating is possibly more interested in making the accusation than looking at the question on its (evidently trivial) merits.

How widely do you spread this philosophy? Does it only apply to school studies?

Murder, idolatry, coveting thy neighbour's odd-toed ungulate; clearly all fair game once nobody's around, really.

 

[DaveC426913]

So basicaly if they got asked a question all they had to do was find the program and execute. I while not very good at math at the time probably actually knew more then they did I bet even though I would not have been able to "answer" questions they could.

I wonder how many of your former classmates landed careers as engineers at BP Oil?

 

[DaveC426913]

No, I suggest you're the one who isn't entirely serious. For instance, you've already stated that I:

• have no moral compass;
• believe stealing is perfectly acceptable behaviour once one gets away with it;
• believe, in fact, that any proscribed behaviour whatsoever is acceptable in the absence of being caught.

I think we can agree that these are rather odd claims that you've made.

These are implications of your claim. If you do believe that something is not cheating if you don't get caught, where is the line drawn? You tell me.

In reference to the specific situation described by the OP, yes, I'd argue quite forcefully that for such a trivial matter as this, it can't reasonably be considered cheating.

So, if it's small enough, it's just too small to fall under the eye of moral conduct?

So, is one silver spoon small enough, or is it only theft if it's the whole box?

My opinion is that anyone who would argue that it was cheating is possibly more interested in making the accusation than looking at the question on its (evidently trivial) merits.

If I were the only one in this thread that felt this way, you might have a point.

[EDIT] No wait. You still wouldn't. It is the OP who is asking, not someone making some unwarranted accusation.

 

[lisab]

I don't see why the Op has to tell the teacher... The teacher should know better then to give out homework that's so easy to do. In my exprience if he tells the teacher he will end up getting the blame for it by both the teacher and the class that is probably using the same site he is to "do" the homework. It's not really his responsiblity but I guess he could take it up and it might be fun to see the responces even if it comes at his expense.

No, easy questions are not the issue. Please re-read the OP.

Answers to the quiz questions are available online. Perhaps the instructor already knows, in which case it's a moot question. But just to be on the safe side, the instructor should be advised.

 

[magpies]

Murder, idolatry, coveting thy neighbour's odd-toed ungulate; clearly all fair game once nobody's around, really.

I think your making his case for him actually.

lisab will you kindly advise his teacher for him I am sure it will help a lot.

 

[TheStatutoryApe]

In matters of ethics, it's always best to err on the safe side. The OP should let the instructor know that the answers to the quizzes are available online.

That is certainly an issue unto itself. I would imagine if he is in college that the instructor likely knows and it probably is not a big deal. If he is in high school then the teacher probably does not know and it may be a good idea to let the teacher know.

I just am not sure about the OPs question of what he is apparently doing with these answers, which does not seem to be cheating to me. If he is doing the same exact problems before class that he will be expected to do in class then I could see this as an issue.

 

[DaveC426913]

I just am not sure about the OPs question of what he is apparently doing with these answers, which does not seem to be cheating to me. If he is doing the same exact problems before class that he will be expected to do in class then I could see this as an issue.

The OP is saying that at least some of the questions on his class assignment are exactly the same as the ones he's found, and that he knows exactly the answers.

He clarifies some things in post #7, including that these assigments do contribute to his final mark.

 

[shoehorn]

These are implications of your claim.

No, they're not; they don't follow at all from anything I've said. They are, however, direct consequences of your rather splendidly tangential claim that:

Nope. A person that believes rules only apply when someone's looking is a person that believes rules only apply when someone's looking.

For the life of me, I can't understand how you've decided upon my utter amorality in the course of two posts.

If you do believe that something is not cheating if you don't get caught, where is the line drawn? You tell me.

For me, the line is drawn wherever I'm comfortable drawing it, just as you draw your own conclusions about it. The general question is, after all, entirely subjective by its very definition.

So, if it's small enough, it's just too small to fall under the eye of moral conduct?

Of course. If, for instance, you agreed to share a box of chocolates with someone, would you really consider it to be immoral if they ended up thoughtlessly taking one more than you? Would you really check to see if they'd stolen any of your stuff simply because they'd had one more Vanilla Fudge than you?

So, is one silver spoon small enough, or is it only theft if it's the whole box?

Again, I have no idea why you've chosen to claim I believe depriving someone else of their property is acceptable behaviour.

Indeed, were I a more sensitive soul I might even regard the repeated implications as a personal attack. Thankfully I'm a bit more robust than that, though.

If I were the only one in this thread that felt this way, you might have a point.

Oh please, now you're appealing to proof by simple majority. This really is becoming silly.

 

[TheStatutoryApe]

The OP is saying that at least some of the questions on his class assignment are exactly the same as the ones he's found, and that he knows exactly the answers.

But he still has to do the work in class, he can not simply write the answer... its iffy. A high school teacher may not like it though at the same time the teacher may also be happy to have a student who actually tries to understand the work in what ever fashion they are doing so. Since it contributes to his mark that may be cheating, if the teacher counts how many are correct and not just whether or not the work was done. Otherwise I do not think it is all that different than studying.

 

[lisab]

But he still has to do the work in class, he can not simply write the answer... its iffy. A high school teacher may not like it though at the same time the teacher may also be happy to have a student who actually tries to understand the work in what ever fashion they are doing so. Since it contributes to his mark that may be cheating, if the teacher counts how many are correct and not just whether or not the work was done. Otherwise I do not think it is all that different than studying.

But it's that iffy-ness that would bother me. I'd definitely clear it with the instructor.

 

[magpies]

I'm pretty sure the only way this instructor is going to find out is if he visits the site himself accidently. :)

 

[ViewsofMars]

So I have in-class assignment every week. The questions on it are some of the challenge questions in textbook. I found the complete solution online so I try to do all the questions before the class to get ready. Since I know the correct answer and everything before doing it in class, is it considered cheating?

Hi caljice (OP). I think you asking that question means to me that you are concerned that you might be cheating. I don't think cheating is a good thing. The reason is simple. It diminishes your chance of grasping information and finding a solution on your own, which can also be applied later on in life. It's better to challenge yourself. Knowledge is a powerful tool. The more you learn the better person you'll be.

 

[caljuice]

Thanks for the replies guys. Surprised by the flood of posts. Half of it is argueing over some weird moral point.

Yeah this was definitely just about morals. I'm personally against cheating like letting people copy assignments, quizes, and what not. This just felt more on the grey line to me.

I don't plan to tell her. The teacher already knows there are solutions online. I think most teacher would know. She told me some students had brought in their iphones with solution manuals to class before. She knows she can't stop cheating but just says they are hurting themselves. She said she doesn't care about it, unless she catches you. Thus not to get caught.

I don't entirely agree with what I'm doing is hurting my capabilities to learn physics. As this is how I would normally study for most classes anyway. I do questions and check if I did them right or what I did wrong. Except, normally I wouldn't know the answer on the tests. I always make sure I know how the question is done. I spent like 2 hour on one question even though I had the complete solution guide, to make sure I got every concept. But I guess it does affect working under the pressure of time?

Also, does it change anything if I said the actual answer is only 1 mark and the work (mainly getting concepts correct) and effort are the other 90%.

Not sure I'm going to do anything with the answers. I was just curious lol and I wanted people say my view was good. But guess it wasn't. If I feel too guilty or I believe it is affecting my performance, then i'll stop.

Oh you I'm in college.