Is critical angle diagram realistic?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the realism of critical angle diagrams in optics, particularly focusing on the behavior of light at the critical angle and the implications of the principle of reversibility. Participants explore the complexities of ray diagrams, wave behavior, and the limitations of textbook representations.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question the accuracy of textbook diagrams at the critical angle, suggesting that the ray's behavior becomes undefined at this point.
  • Others argue that the principle of reversibility should still apply, although there is debate about the implications of light being incident at exactly 90 degrees.
  • A few participants highlight that the critical angle represents a limiting case, where approaching but not reaching 90 degrees allows for clearer behavior of light.
  • Concerns are raised about the intensity of the refracted ray decreasing to zero at the critical angle, suggesting that a ray diagram may not adequately represent this scenario.
  • Some participants express frustration over the lack of detail in textbooks regarding these complexities, indicating that missing information can lead to confusion among students.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally express multiple competing views regarding the interpretation of critical angle diagrams and the behavior of light at the critical angle. There is no consensus on the realism of these diagrams or the implications of the principle of reversibility.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the discussion involves assumptions about the behavior of light at boundaries, the role of intensity, and the limitations of textbook representations. The conversation reflects a range of perspectives on how these factors contribute to understanding critical angles.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to students and educators in optics, physics, and engineering, particularly those exploring the nuances of light behavior and critical angles in refraction.

bhauta
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as per diagrams in textbooks, if incidence angle = critical angle then the ray should travel straight until it reaches the surface of the denser medium and then go tangentially to the boundary something like the following

http://www.antonine-education.co.uk/Physics%20A%20level/Unit_2/Waves/Refraction/Refract_8.gif

if i now place a mirror vertically against this ray (which is tangentially traveling) , will it exactly trace its path? As per 'principle of reversibility' it should. However, it cannot 'know' where exactly it had bent.

therefore it seems to me that the behavior of ray with i=90' is somewhat undefined ( like tan 90'). please tell me experts where i am unclear.
 
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It's more complicated than a ray diagram. Waves have to be used.
This is done in an optics or EM textbook.
 
A situation is usually undefined at a boundary condition.
That's what the boundary is here; a point where one law ceases to apply and another takes over.
Actually, there should also be a reflected ray in your diagram; and this ray can be reversed.
 
The principle of reversibilty is preserved. In the derivation of cosec(ic) =µ, light is made incident at 90 degrees, but that does not make sense.To be incident, it has to be actually a little lesser than 90
 
Isn't it just a 'limiting case' though? Go to 89.999 degrees and it will work ok.
Stonebridge. Yes, they often miss out the reflected ray which is very sloppy and doesn't help in the understanding.
 
There is something missing from the picture: the intensity of the refracted ray.
This decreases as the angle goes towards the critical value and it's exactly zero at the critical angle. So the red line tangent to the surface represents a "ray" of zero intensity and if you put a mirror in its path there is actually nothing to reflect back.

So the diagram is just an aid to calculate the critical angle (set the angle of refraction to 90 degrees and apply Snell's law).
 
sophiecentaur said:
Isn't it just a 'limiting case' though? Go to 89.999 degrees and it will work ok.
And at 89.999 degrees there isn't an issue with the principle of reversibility
 
I agree.
But is it worth losing any sleep over? Mine was an Engineer's response and a Mathematician's response would probably be to worry a lot about it.
But a Physicist should be aware that there is a finite thickness involved to the interface and diffraction and quantum physics and lots of other things which really imply that 90 degrees exactly can be ignored.
 
nasu said:
There is something missing from the picture: the intensity of the refracted ray.
This decreases as the angle goes towards the critical value and it's exactly zero at the critical angle. So the red line tangent to the surface represents a "ray" of zero intensity and if you put a mirror in its path there is actually nothing to reflect back.

So the diagram is just an aid to calculate the critical angle (set the angle of refraction to 90 degrees and apply Snell's law).
thanks nasu for the most convincing answer. Thank you all

sophiecentaur said:
I agree.
But is it worth losing any sleep over? Mine was an Engineer's response and a Mathematician's response would probably be to worry a lot about it.
But a Physicist should be aware that there is a finite thickness involved to the interface and diffraction and quantum physics and lots of other things which really imply that 90 degrees exactly can be ignored.

Well I looked for a textbook-writer's response. Had the author made a brief note of indefiniteness( also the decreased intensity or the presence of additional refracted ray), why would i post the question?
 
  • #10
It can't be the first bit if inadequacy that you've seen in a textbook. There are drop offs in so many textbooks and many students get confused. They can get very stroppy when told the book's wrong.
 

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