News Is President Obama Ignoring Intelligent Online Input?

[mugaliens]

Perhaps then he might get a clue, and start acting on the inputs of the best and the brightest out here on the Internet. Even though we might disagree, we do so intelligently.

Given what he's done so far, I haven't the slightest clue as to what he's acting on.

 

[DevilsAvocado]

Given what he's done so far, I haven't the slightest clue as to what he's acting on.

That’s because you underestimate President Obama’s intelligence, and overestimate some PF users.

 

[Evo]

That’s because you underestimate President Obama’s intelligence, and overestimate some PF users.

 

[russ_watters]

Most arrogant thread of the day.

 

[OmCheeto]

Zip!

muffle muffle muffle!

 

[mugaliens]

That’s because you underestimate President Obama’s intelligence, and overestimate some PF users.

I'm sorry, but I actually know him. I don't think I'm "underestimating" anything.

 

[DevilsAvocado]

Most surprising thread of the day.

 

[Proton Soup]

I'm sorry, but I actually know him. I don't think I'm "underestimating" anything.

go on...

 

[DevilsAvocado]

 

[Pattonias]

I think he would get a kick out of it.

 

[Char. Limit]

Please. The PF P&WA people are far too smart for any politician to understand us.

 

[nismaratwork]

Most arrogant thread of the day.

Hmmm, do you count content or just newly made threads? If it's content, a bunch of amateurs and armchair economists passionately denouncing the president of the US is probably far more arrogant than a simple desire to be heard.

This is supposed to be something of an internet brain-trust after all... if not the PF mentors, then who... right? I know when I want my social and economic problems solved, I look first to the engineers and physicists!

 

[Pengwuino]

Please. The PF P&WA people are far too smart for any politician to understand us.

And penguins

 

[nismaratwork]

If I had a signature, it would just be: "and penguins", along the lines of adding, "in bed" to fortune cookie.

 

[Zarqon]

On a more realistic, and perhaps also more interesting, note, I would think it would be very cool if the opposite happened, i.e. the ruling people came here to tell us what they were really thinking. There's been so many times where I've just thought that persons like Obama must act the way they do in certain situations just because they have access to more information about the issue then we have. I would love to understand what actually lead them to certain decisions, and what their honest thoughts are on how to best organize our future society (not what they say in media).

 

[nismaratwork]

On a more realistic, and perhaps also more interesting, note, I would think it would be very cool if the opposite happened, i.e. the ruling people came here to tell us what they were really thinking. There's been so many times where I've just thought that persons like Obama must act the way they do in certain situations just because they have access to more information about the issue then we have. I would love to understand what actually lead them to certain decisions, and what their honest thoughts are on how to best organize our future society (not what they say in media).

I'm not sure you'd be comforted by honest answer to the motivations of ANYONE who reaches such high office.

 

[Zarqon]

I'm not sure you'd be comforted by honest answer to the motivations of ANYONE who reaches such high office.

That's ok though, because my main interest in general is not being comforted, but to understand how things really work

 

[nismaratwork]

That's ok though, because my main interest in general is not being comforted, but to understand how things really work

http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/dsm-iv/content/article/10168/54831

Camouflage Society
In my book, Without Conscience, I argued that we live in a "camouflage society," a society in which some psychopathic traits- egocentricity, lack of concern for others, superficiality, style over substance, being "cool," manipulativeness, and so forth- increasingly are tolerated and even valued. With respect to the topic of this article, it is easy to see how both psychopaths and those with ASPD could blend in readily with groups holding antisocial or criminal values. It is more difficult to envisage how those with ASPD could hide out among more prosocial segments of society. Yet psychopaths have little difficulty infiltrating the domains of business, politics, law enforcement, government, academia and other social structures (Babiak). It is the egocentric, cold-blooded and remorseless psychopaths who blend into all aspects of society and have such devastating impacts on people around them who send chills down the spines of law enforcement officers.

This is just opinion, but it's something that's been noted as the understanding of AsPD has grown. People who seek adrenaline thrills without regard for their own health, the impact on others... politicians from the obvious (Blagojevich) to the more subtle who merely display AsPD traits, or something in the spectrum of NPD.

 

[OmCheeto]

http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/dsm-iv/content/article/10168/54831

This is just opinion...

I consider it fact, but that's just my opinion.

 

[nismaratwork]

I consider it fact, but that's just my opinion.

Yes.

 

[Proton Soup]

That's ok though, because my main interest in general is not being comforted, but to understand how things really work

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military%E2%80%93industrial_complex"

A vital element in keeping the peace is our military establishment. Our arms must be mighty, ready for instant action, so that no potential aggressor may be tempted to risk his own destruction...

This conjunction of an immense military establishment and a large arms industry is new in the American experience. The total influence — economic, political, even spiritual — is felt in every city, every statehouse, every office of the federal government. We recognize the imperative need for this development. Yet we must not fail to comprehend its grave implications. Our toil, resources and livelihood are all involved; so is the very structure of our society. In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist. We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals so that security and liberty may prosper together.

 

[Zarqon]

http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/dsm-iv/content/article/10168/54831


This is just opinion, but it's something that's been noted as the understanding of AsPD has grown. People who seek adrenaline thrills without regard for their own health, the impact on others... politicians from the obvious (Blagojevich) to the more subtle who merely display AsPD traits, or something in the spectrum of NPD.

Wow, I'm quite amazed that what I thought was a pretty innocent sentence, sparked that response (though I'm not offended). I am however curious if wanting to know how things work more than wanting to be comforted (tbh, I consider it a comfort to know how things work, so that I can predict them), is really sticking out that much as anti-social behavior?

 

[mugaliens]

Hmmm, do you count content or just newly made threads? If it's content, a bunch of amateurs and armchair economists passionately denouncing the president of the US is probably far more arrogant than a simple desire to be heard.

As a reader of The Economist and The Wall Street Journal (two of the less fluffier publications), I find many of this "bunch of amateurs and armchair economists" a savvy about that which they speak.

This is supposed to be something of an internet brain-trust after all... if not the PF mentors, then who... right? I know when I want my social and economic problems solved, I look first to the engineers and physicists!

Good logic. In the same vein, why did we vote for a lawyer and neophyte politician to lead our country?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megyn_Kelly" for President! Interestingly, she has a nearly identical education as our President, but a totaly different point of view. Funny how that works...

 

[G01]

Perhaps then he might get a clue, and start acting on the inputs of the best and the brightest out here on the Internet.

The bold part made my day, no my week!

 

[OmCheeto]

Perhaps then he might get a clue, and start acting on the inputs of the best and the brightest out here on the Internet. Even though we might disagree, we do so intelligently.

Given what he's done so far, I haven't the slightest clue as to what he's acting on.

Hey! I think someone in the White House just read your thread.

"[URL
Advise the Advisor[/URL]

Advise the Advisor is a new program to help senior staff at the White House stay connected to the American people. Think of this as your direct line to the some of the President's senior advisors at the White House.

Don't make him read through all the arguments though. Just tell him how he should run the country.

 

[Al68]

...Just tell him how he should run the country.

I'd rather tell him to stop trying to run the country. Being the radical right-winger I am, I favor a free country over a government run country. And being such a radical strict constructionist, I'd point out that "running the country" isn't in the President's job description, or an enumerated power of the federal government.

 

[jduster]

As incompetent and pernicious as I think his administration is, Barack Obama has better things to do than to surf forums.

 

[DanP]

A complete waste of time for anyone at their level.

 

[nismaratwork]

I'd rather tell him to stop trying to run the country. Being the radical right-winger I am, I favor a free country over a government run country. And being such a radical strict constructionist, I'd point out that "running the country" isn't in the President's job description, or an enumerated power of the federal government.

There's no freedom in chaos, just older laws of the jungle. In that kind of world, people like me kill people like you for sport; this is a better world.

 

[DanP]

There's no freedom in chaos, just older laws of the jungle. In that kind of world, people like me kill people like you for sport; this is a better world.

You misunderstood him. He wants laws to protect him, but he doesn't want laws to protect others :P

 

[nismaratwork]

You misunderstood him. He wants laws to protect him, but he doesn't want laws to protect others :P

He's young... presumably, and doesn't realize that he's advocating his own kingship, or serfdom.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vl9WfOdSkM

 

[nismaratwork]

Heh...

Truly, isn't this the heart of "Libertarianism" as it's bandied about now? Nihilism for everyone... except X or Y group, who naturally self-organizes.

Should we tell him he's halfway to communism?

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Heh...

Truly, isn't this the heart of "Libertarianism" as it's bandied about now? Nihilism for everyone... except X or Y group, who naturally self-organizes.

Should we tell him he's halfway to communism?

It is one thing to voice opinions and analyze problems for the sake of public discourse and education, but it is quite another to assume that we know something "they" don't; or that the average Presidential advisor isn't a heck of a lot smarter, better informed, and more accomplished than everyone, or at least, almost everyone here. I would imagine we have 2 or 3 members [all of PF] who are qualified to stand among the average run-of-the-mill advisors, in the White House.

 

[nismaratwork]

It is one thing to voice opinions and analyze problems for the sake of public discourse and education, but it is quite another to assume that we know something "they" don't; or that the average Presidential advisor isn't a heck of a lot smarter, better informed, and more accomplished than everyone, or at least, almost everyone here.

Indeed, and above all: Specialized! A man like David Gergen for instance, or David Axelrod could serve any president well, and would blow us out of the water.

By the same token, you see it here with engineers learning that those skills only HELP with theoretical physics, and visa versa. I'm not taking my car to a mechanical engineer, I'm takign it to my MECHANIC. I'm also not going to ask my mechanic to design new jet, or furnace, etc.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Indeed, and above all: Specialized! A man like David Gergen for instance, or David Axelrod could serve any president well, and would blow us out of the water.

By the same token, you see it here with engineers learning that those skills only HELP with theoretical physics, and visa versa. I'm not taking my car to a mechanical engineer, I'm takign it to my MECHANIC. I'm also not going to ask my mechanic to design new jet, or furnace, etc.

Gergen is probably the man I most respect among the pundits and former advisors. Though a conservative philosophically, he is also bipartisan and served under Presidents from both parties - he served under four Presidents! You can trust him to state his honest opinion and not some party line.

When there is no clear path, I always look to Gergen for guidance.

 

[nismaratwork]

Gergen is probably the man I most respect among the pundits and former advisors. Though a conservative philosophically, he is also bipartisan and served under Presidents from both parties - he served under four Presidents! You can trust him to state his honest opinion and not some party line.

When there is no clear path, I always look to Gergen for guidance.

I agree, he's also absurdly bright and well spoken... and you can see others listen to him... even those who disagree. Like Warren Buffet... he's a force.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I agree, he's also absurdly bright and well spoken... and you can see others listen to him... even those who disagree. Like Warren Buffet... he's a force.

And those who waste their time with the likes of Limbaugh and Beck, or MSNBC for that matter, would be well-served to follow Gergen instead. Of course, this would completely destroy the illusion... and our country would be far better off.

 

[Proton Soup]

i often found enlightenment from Dick Morris and his bridge-burning strategy.

 

[nismaratwork]

i often found enlightenment from Dick Morris and his bridge-burning strategy.

A cautionary tale?

@Ivan: Agreed.

 

[Proton Soup]

A cautionary tale?

@Ivan: Agreed.

i haven't watched him in a while. i assume he still does analysis for Fox. but he always gave an insider view into the way these people really think. at least for the politickin to the public side of things.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

i haven't watched him in a while. i assume he still does analysis for Fox. but he always gave an insider view into the way these people really think. at least for the politickin to the public side of things.

To my knowledge he was never on Fox and I get no hits indicating otherwise. He is the senior political analyst for CNN though. [Whoops, maybe you didn't mean Gergen?]

I should point out that while that clip from The West Wing was pretty harsh, it was too funny to pass up given the context of this thread. And I'm sure every staff member has been accused of running a dictatorship at least a few times. I was even accused of being a secret agent for the Government once! Also, Evo doesn't smoke. I don't know if she has a fondness for moo moos.

 

[Al68]

There's no freedom in chaos, just older laws of the jungle. In that kind of world, people like me kill people like you for sport; this is a better world.

What on Earth are you talking about now? It's simply impossible to misread my post that insanely.

He's young... presumably, and doesn't realize that he's advocating his own kingship, or serfdom.

First, I'm probably twice or three times your age, at least, just guessing. Second, and more relevant, I advocated no such thing. Misrepresenting the views of others is not honest discourse. I advocate libertarianism. Not anarchy, chaos, kingships, serfdoms, or any other such nonsense that could only be confused with libertarianism by those completely unfamiliar with it.

Have you forgotten that by today's standards, the U.S. was founded as a libertarian paradise with a constitution that tried to ensure it? That libertarianism is the central theme of the constitution?

Heh...

Truly, isn't this the heart of "Libertarianism" as it's bandied about now? Nihilism for everyone... except X or Y group, who naturally self-organizes.

Should we tell him he's halfway to communism?

Try learning something about what you're talking about. The claim of nihilism is completely nonsensical, as is the claim of being halfway to communism. Libertarianism and communism are at the opposite ends of the political spectrum.

It serves no purpose to just keep on fabricating a bunch of logically incoherent nonsense and posting it.

 

[Al68]

You misunderstood him. He wants laws to protect him, but he doesn't want laws to protect others :P

Complete nonsense, and you know it. What is with people just fabricating hateful nonsense without any regard whatsoever? Try substantiating your claim. If you even considered whether it could be substantiated you would have realized immediately it was nonsense.

And you claiming you know what I want because you're psychic won't fly, even with others who don't inherently know better like me. How about some semblance of a standard for making asinine claims about other forum members?

 

[Char. Limit]

This thread is so off-topic it's not even funny. Except for the fact that it is. Keep going, it's kind of entertaining!

 

[DanP]

Complete nonsense, and you know it. What is with people just fabricating hateful nonsense without any regard whatsoever? Try substantiating your claim. If you even considered whether it could be substantiated you would have realized immediately it was nonsense.

And you claiming you know what I want because you're psychic won't fly, even with others who don't inherently know better like me. How about some semblance of a standard for making asinine claims about other forum members?

It is my perception of your statements regarding your preference against a government run country and your self cataloging statement that you are an right wing radical. Right wing extrema has nothing to do with "libertarianism" as you claim in your previous post. Rather, right wing extrema politics usually include racism, supremacy, authoritarianism.

As whatever this perception is true or false, biased or non-biased, it doesn't matter. You self cataloged yourself as a member of radical right wing , and history has shown time and again that those politic lead to an legislation biased towards oppression of others in the favor of a certain class.

 

[Al68]

It is my perception of your statements regarding your preference against a government run country and your self cataloging statement that you are an right wing radical. Right wing extrema has nothing to do with "libertarianism" as you claim in your previous post. Rather, right wing extrema politics usually include racism, supremacy, authoritarianism.

As whatever this perception is true or false, biased or non-biased, it doesn't matter. You self cataloged yourself as a member of radical right wing , and history has shown time and again that those politic lead to legislation biased towards oppression of others in the favor of a certain class.

You can't possibly be so dense as to think I was describing myself as an authoritarian racist. You must know I was referring to myself as a "right-wing radical" simply because it's common for the left to use that phrase to refer to economically libertarian-minded people. And you must know it is far more common today, particularly in this forum, for lefties to use the phrase to refer to advocates of low taxes and deregulation.

And the fact that I simultaneously called myself a "right-wing radical" and a libertarian logically ruled out what you claim to think it meant.

You are not so uninformed as to think that phrase isn't routinely used to refer to economic libertarians, so why pretend to be? Why not just retract your statements?

 

[DanP]

You can't possibly be so dense as to think I was describing myself as an authoritarian racist. You must know I was referring to myself as a "right-wing radical" simply because it's common for the left to use that phrase to refer to economically libertarian-minded people. And you must know it is far more common today, particularly in this forum, for lefties to use the phrase to refer to advocates of low taxes and deregulation.

You self-cataloged in the political spectrum. I just took your word for it. Can you ask me for anything else ?

And the fact that I simultaneously called myself a "right-wing radical" and a libertarian logically ruled out what you claim to think it meant.

It can mean a lot of things. It doesn't rule out anything. Besides, a lesson in politics is that you should be very careful what you say in your political discourse. You simply let too much material to be leveraged against you with statements like "Im a right wing extremist". Any political adversary will use that against you to gain capital. And you simply can't blame them. You served yourself, to say so.

You are not so uninformed as to think that phrase isn't routinely used to refer to economic libertarians, so why pretend to be? Why not just retract your statements?

Simply because I have nothing to retract. If you wish to be perceived differently, reconsider your position in the political spectrum.

 

[Al68]

Simply because I have nothing to retract. If you wish to be perceived differently, reconsider your position in the political spectrum.

No, I will not. I know exactly where I am in the spectrum. And if you choose to make claims that contradict what I have made perfectly clear about my position, that's all on you. And I know that the overwhelmingly most common use of the phrase "right wing radical" in this forum is to refer to anyone who advocates less regulation and taxes, or economic libertarianism.

What do you call the part of the political spectrum of someone who advocates unregulated free markets and low taxes, and no income taxes? Left-wing radicals?

But I'm not going back and forth about it. I'm a libertarian, and I've spent decades being called a right-wing radical by Democrats because of it. I have no obligation now to meet your semantic guidelines for what to call myself. Especially when I know you were never ignorant enough to actually believe what you were saying to begin with.

 

[nismaratwork]

What on Earth are you talking about now? It's simply impossible to misread my post that insanely.First, I'm probably twice or three times your age, at least, just guessing. Second, and more relevant, I advocated no such thing. Misrepresenting the views of others is not honest discourse. I advocate libertarianism. Not anarchy, chaos, kingships, serfdoms, or any other such nonsense that could only be confused with libertarianism by those completely unfamiliar with it.

Have you forgotten that by today's standards, the U.S. was founded as a libertarian paradise with a constitution that tried to ensure it? That libertarianism is the central theme of the constitution?Try learning something about what you're talking about. The claim of nihilism is completely nonsensical, as is the claim of being halfway to communism. Libertarianism and communism are at the opposite ends of the political spectrum.

It serves no purpose to just keep on fabricating a bunch of logically incoherent nonsense and posting it.

I'd give a detailed response, but others such as DanP already have quite nicely.