Is Relativity Automatically Accounted for in Maxwell's Equations?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around whether special relativity is inherently accounted for in Maxwell's equations. Participants explore the implications of relativity on electromagnetic fields, particularly focusing on the transformation of electric and magnetic fields between different reference frames. The conversation includes theoretical considerations and mathematical formulations related to electromagnetism.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant recalls being taught that special relativity is built into Maxwell's equations but questions why corrections are needed for different frames when calculating the magnetic field.
  • Another participant emphasizes that the electromagnetic field is a single entity that transforms according to Lorentz transformations, suggesting that this mixing of electric and magnetic fields is what is built into Maxwell's equations.
  • A participant acknowledges the need to consider both electric and magnetic fields in different frames and expresses confusion about how relativity is integrated into electromagnetism.
  • One participant references the ability to derive the speed of light from the wave equations of electric and magnetic fields but still questions the integration of relativity into electromagnetism.
  • Another participant discusses the Lorentz covariance of Maxwell's equations and suggests that they can be expressed in a form that is manifestly Lorentz covariant by using the electromagnetic field strength tensor.
  • A participant raises a question about whether Newtonian mechanics could also be considered Lorentz covariant, prompting a response that indicates modifications are necessary to make Newtonian mechanics relativistic.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether relativity is inherently built into Maxwell's equations. While some argue that the equations are Lorentz covariant and thus account for relativity, others remain unconvinced and seek further clarification on the matter. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing perspectives.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference various mathematical formulations and transformations related to electromagnetic fields, indicating a reliance on specific definitions and assumptions that may not be universally agreed upon. The discussion includes unresolved questions about the implications of these transformations on the understanding of electromagnetism.

cragar
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I remember when I took E&M my teacher said that special relativity was built into Maxwells equations.
Let's look at a line charge moving at non-relativistic speeds first.
We use amperes Law to find the B field.
frame 1: [itex]B=\frac{\mu_0 v \lambda }{2 \pi r }[/itex]

frame 2: relativistic speed [itex]B'=\frac{\mu_0 \lambda v' \gamma }{2 \pi r }[/itex]
in frame 2 the line charge becomes length contracted so the gamma factor takes care of that.
v and v' are the speeds relative to the moving charge.
Now if relativity was built into maxwells equations why did I need to correct for frame 2.
Or if I knew the charge per length in frame 2 at speed v' then would I calculate it just like frame 1.
If I know the correct charge density at any speed do I just calculate it normally with amperes law and there is no need for a relativistic correction.
I know there is an E field in each frame but I am just looking at the B field.
 
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hi cragar! :smile:
cragar said:
I know there is an E field in each frame but I am just looking at the B field.

ah, that's where you're missing the point …

E&M isn't just E and M

the E&M field is one field, and it transforms (as a 2-form) according to the lorentz transformation, mixing up the E and M bits

that mixing by the lorentz transformation is what is built into maxwell's equations :wink:
Now if relativity was built into maxwells equations why did I need to correct for frame 2.

you measure velocity differently in each frame, so what is strange about measuring distance differently in each frame? :smile:
 
ok you I should pay attention to both E and B cause in some frames processes are Electric and magnetic.
Ok I understand how if v changes in different frames then so will the length contraction.
I still don't see why relativity is built into E&M yet. I do know that you can derive c from the wave equations of E and B.
 
cragar said:
I still don't see why relativity is built into E&M yet. I do know that you can derive c from the wave equations of E and B.

from the pf library on Maxwell's equations

Changing to units in which [itex]\varepsilon_0[/itex] [itex]\mu_0[/itex] and [itex]c[/itex] are 1, we may combine the two 3-vectors [itex]\mathbf{E}[/itex] and [itex]\mathbf{B}[/itex] into the 6-component Faraday 2-form [itex](\mathbf{E};\mathbf{B})[/itex], or its dual, the Maxwell 2-form [itex](\mathbf{E};\mathbf{B})^*[/itex].

And we may define the current 4-vector J as [itex](Q_f,\mathbf{j}_f)[/itex].

Then the differential versions of Gauss' Law and the Ampère-Maxwell Law can be combined as:

[tex]\nabla \times (\mathbf{E};\mathbf{B})^*\,=\,(\nabla \cdot \mathbf{E}\ ,\ \frac{\partial\mathbf{E}}{\partial t}\,+\,\nabla\times\mathbf{B})^*\,=\,J^*[/tex]

and those of Gauss' Law for Magnetism and Faraday's Law can be combined as:

[tex]\nabla \times (\mathbf{E};\mathbf{B}) = (\nabla \cdot \mathbf{B}\ ,\ \frac{\partial\mathbf{B}}{\partial t}\,+\,\nabla\times\mathbf{E})^*\,=\,0[/tex]​

the last two equations are clearly lorentz covariant! :smile:

(to see how to transform (E;B), write it as …

##E_x\mathbf{x}\wedge\mathbf{t} + E_y\mathbf{y}\wedge\mathbf{t} + E_z\mathbf{z}\wedge\mathbf{t} + B_x\mathbf{y}\wedge\mathbf{z} + B_y\mathbf{z}\wedge\mathbf{x} + B_z\mathbf{x}\wedge\mathbf{y}##​

and then use the lorentz transformation on the individual x y z and t , together of course with ##\mathbf{x}\wedge\mathbf{x} = 0, \mathbf{x}\wedge\mathbf{y} = -\mathbf{y}\wedge\mathbf{x}##)
 
cragar said:
I still don't see why relativity is built into E&M yet
It is a manifestly Lorentz covariant field theory. All you have to do is take the standard Maxwell equations written using vector calculus, define the electromagnetic field strength tensor, and rewrite the equations using the space-time derivative operator to put it into a form that is manifestly Lorentz covariant.
 
ok thanks, wouldn't a lot of Newtonian mechanics be Lorentz covariant. like momentum.
 

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