Is the argument sound? Yes, the argument is sound.

AI Thread Summary
The discussion centers on proving that if a and b are nonzero real numbers satisfying the inequalities a < 1/a < b < 1/b, then it must follow that a < -1. Initial attempts to establish a contradiction by considering cases for a (either positive or negative) reveal inconsistencies, particularly when assuming a ≥ -1. Feedback highlights that the argument does not adequately address the implications of b and fails to establish the contradiction effectively. Ultimately, a clearer approach shows that if a < 1/a, it leads to the conclusion that a must be less than -1.
Keen94
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Homework Statement


Suppose that a and b are nonzero real numbers. Prove that if a< 1/a < b < 1/b then a<-1.

Homework Equations


Givens: a and b are nonzero real numbers, a< 1/a < b < 1/b, and a≥-1.
Goal: Arrive at a contradiction.

The Attempt at a Solution


Scratch work: First establish whether a<0 or a>0.
Case i.) a>0 and Case ii.) a<0
Case i). a>0. a( a<1/a) ⇒ a2<1 and a(a≥-1) ⇒ a2≥-a.
However a2≥0 and -a<0. Therefore a>0 contradicts the fact that a is at leas greater than or equal to -1.
Is the argument sound? Thanks for the feedback!
 
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Keen94 said:

Homework Statement


Suppose that a and b are nonzero real numbers. Prove that if a< 1/a < b < 1/b then a<-1.

Homework Equations


Givens: a and b are nonzero real numbers, a< 1/a < b < 1/b, and a≥-1.
Goal: Arrive at a contradiction.

The Attempt at a Solution


Scratch work: First establish whether a<0 or a>0.
Case i.) a>0 and Case ii.) a<0
Case i). a>0. a( a<1/a) ⇒ a2<1 and a(a≥-1) ⇒ a2≥-a.
However a2≥0 and -a<0. Therefore a>0 contradicts the fact that a is at leas greater than or equal to -1.
Is the argument sound? Thanks for the feedback!
Your argument doesn't do anything with b, which could also be either negative or positive.

Your hypothesis is (in part) that a < 1/a and that b < 1/b. What do these inequalities say about the numbers a and 1/a and b and 1/b?

Your other hypothesis is that a -1.
 
Keen94 said:

Homework Statement


Suppose that a and b are nonzero real numbers. Prove that if a< 1/a < b < 1/b then a<-1.

Homework Equations


Givens: a and b are nonzero real numbers, a< 1/a < b < 1/b, and a≥-1.
Goal: Arrive at a contradiction.

The Attempt at a Solution


Scratch work: First establish whether a<0 or a>0.
Case i.) a>0 and Case ii.) a<0
Case i). a>0. a( a<1/a) ⇒ a2<1 and a(a≥-1) ⇒ a2≥-a.
However a2≥0 and -a<0. Therefore a>0 contradicts the fact that a is at leas greater than or equal to -1.
Is the argument sound? Thanks for the feedback!
No. Take ##a=1/2## for example. Clearly, ##a>0## holds so ##a \ge -1## does as well. Moreover, you have ##a^2 = 1/4 \ge 0## and ##-a = -1/2 < 0##. There's no apparent contradiction.
 
Keen94 said:

Homework Statement


Suppose that a and b are nonzero real numbers. Prove that if a< 1/a < b < 1/b then a<-1.

Homework Equations


Givens: a and b are nonzero real numbers, a< 1/a < b < 1/b, and a≥-1.
Goal: Arrive at a contradiction.

The Attempt at a Solution


Scratch work: First establish whether a<0 or a>0.
Case i.) a>0 and Case ii.) a<0
Case i). a>0. a( a<1/a) ⇒ a2<1 and a(a≥-1) ⇒ a2≥-a.
However a2≥0 and -a<0. Therefore a>0 contradicts the fact that a is at leas greater than or equal to -1.
Is the argument sound? Thanks for the feedback!
I don't see any where in here where you establish the "fact" that "a is greater than or equal to -1" that you say is contradicted. Of course, in the case that a> 0 it certainly must be greater than -1, but that doesn't seem to be what you are referring to. You do show, correctly, that a2≥-a. But that's trivially true if x> 0. It certainly doesn't contradict "a is greater than or equal to -1"!
 
I see I forgot to post the solution here. woops sorry guys.

If a,b≠0 and a<1/a<b<1/b then a<-1
We can see that
a<1/b ⇒ab<1 if b>0 or it implies that ab>1 if b<0
and
1/a<b ⇒ab<1 if a<0 or it implies that ab>1 if a>0
We can conclude that ab<1 when b>0 and a<0 otherwise the inequality a<b does not hold.
Since a<1/a
then a2>1 since a<0
therefore lal>1
⇒a>1 or a<-1 bur a<0 thus a<-1.
 
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