Is the group of positive rational numbers under * cyclic?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around whether the group of positive rational numbers under multiplication is a cyclic group. Participants explore the definition of cyclic groups and the implications for the set of positive rational numbers.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the requirement for a group to be cyclic, specifically the need for an element that can generate all other elements. There is uncertainty about how to prove that no single fraction can generate all positive rational numbers. Questions arise regarding the meaning of notation used in the context of group generation.

Discussion Status

The conversation is ongoing, with participants attempting to clarify concepts and explore different aspects of the problem. Some guidance is offered regarding proving non-cyclicity by considering specific cases, but no consensus has been reached.

Contextual Notes

There is confusion regarding the notation for generated groups and the distinction between operations in addition versus multiplication. Participants are also grappling with how to approach the proof of non-cyclicity.

Mr Davis 97
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Homework Statement


Is the group of positive rational numbers under multiplication a cyclic group.

Homework Equations

The Attempt at a Solution


So a group is cyclic if and only if there exists a element in G that generates all of the elements in G.
So the set of positive rational numbers would be cyclic if we could find a fraction a/b such that (a/b)^n, where n is an integer, generates all elements of positive Q.

I feel like the group is not cyclic, which means that I would have to prove that for all elements in positive Q, they don't generate positive Q. I am not sure exactly how to approach this... For (a/b)^n, do I have to find another fraction in terms of a and b such that (a/b)^n can't equal that expression for any n?
 
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What does ##<\frac{1}{2}\; , \;\frac{1}{3}>## mean? I thought that one only looks at what subgroup is generated by a single element, in this case a single fraction
 
Mr Davis 97 said:

Homework Statement


Is the group of positive rational numbers under multiplication a cyclic group.

Homework Equations

The Attempt at a Solution


So a group is cyclic if and only if there exists a element in G that generates all of the elements in G.
So the set of positive rational numbers would be cyclic if we could find a fraction a/b such that (a/b)^n, where n is an integer, generates all elements of positive Q.

I feel like the group is not cyclic, which means that I would have to prove that for all elements in positive Q, they don't generate positive Q. I am not sure exactly how to approach this... For (a/b)^n, do I have to find another fraction in terms of a and b such that (a/b)^n can't equal that expression for any n?
This should work. Solve ##(\frac{a}{b})^n=2## and show that you can't get ##(\frac{a}{b})^m=3## .
 
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Mr Davis 97 said:
What does ##<\frac{1}{2}\; , \;\frac{1}{3}>## mean? I thought that one only looks at what subgroup is generated by a single element, in this case a single fraction
You beat me. I confused addition and multiplication. In general ##<a>## meant to be the group generated by ##a##, so ##<a>=\{a^n\,\vert \,n\in \mathbb{Z}\}## but I was wrong with the example.
 

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