Is there a drag on Earth caused by its motion relative to the CMB rest frame?

  • Context: Undergrad 
  • Thread starter Thread starter substitute materials
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Cmb Drag Earth
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the potential drag on Earth caused by its motion relative to the Cosmic Microwave Background (CMB) rest frame. Participants explore the implications of this motion on the transfer of momentum from CMB photons to Earth, considering both theoretical and practical aspects of the phenomenon.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that the motion relative to the CMB creates a dipole moment in CMB photon wavelengths, suggesting a drag effect on Earth due to its velocity of 600 km/s.
  • One participant calculates a radiation pressure from CMB photons, estimating a force of 32 mN on Earth, leading to an extremely small acceleration over time.
  • Another participant argues that the momentum of Earth is significantly larger than that of CMB photons and that solar photons would have a greater impact on Earth's motion than CMB photons.
  • A participant questions whether there are other scenarios, such as interactions with interstellar or intergalactic dust or gas, where this drag might be more relevant.
  • Some participants clarify that for cosmic rays, the interaction is more about conversion probability rather than drag.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the significance of the drag effect from CMB photons, with some downplaying its relevance compared to other forces acting on Earth, such as solar radiation and collisions with space debris. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the practical implications of this drag.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the calculations depend on various assumptions, including the isotropic re-emission of energy and the influence of other forces like solar radiation. The estimates provided are subject to significant uncertainty and may not fully capture the complexities of the interactions involved.

substitute materials
Messages
39
Reaction score
1
Motion relative to the CMB rest frame creates a dipole moment in the wavelength of CMB photons in the direction of motion. Observations suggest that the Earth has a motion relative to CMB rest frame of 600 km/s.

As indicated in this study, for a spacecraft at a speed we shall dub 'ludicrous speed', the drag from the CMB photons would become very significant, as they would be blueshifted to the point where pair production occurs. This effect also theoretically limits the energy of observed cosmic rays, or at least the distance that such cosmic rays can travel. Even before this point though, momentum will be transferred to the spacecraft , producing drag.

My question is this: Does this drag exist even at the low peculiar velocity of Earth? I imagine it is a vanishingly small force, but it does have an awful long time to act. How would one calculate the force imparted at our peculiar velocity?
 
Space news on Phys.org
Technically: Sure. The energy density is 0.25 eV/cm3. For a rough approximation, assume Earth flies through space and picks up all photons "in front of it", re-emitting the energy isotropically. That is not true as the CMB photons move around, but that will just give some prefactor not far away from 1. Then Earth feels a radiation pressure of ##0.25 \frac{eV}{cm^3} \cdot 600 \frac{km}{s} \frac{1}{c} = 8\cdot 10^{-17} Pa## or a force of 32 mN. This leads to an acceleration of 5*10-27 m/s2. If Earth would freely float through the CMB, over 10 billion years this would change the speed of it by 1.7 nanometers per second. Yeah... forget it. To make it worse, Earth is not floating freely, it orbits the Sun. The column density of Sun is larger by a factor of about 100, so the effect on Sun is even smaller by a factor 100.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: stoomart
The momentum of Earth is quite large compared to CMB photons and CMB photons strike Earth from all directions, not just in the direction of movement. The term 'vanishingly small' is an exaggeration when it comes to characterizing the drag on Earth due to the CMB. Rest assured solar photons would have a greater affect than CMB photons. You can play around with this calculator; http://www.georgedishman.f2s.com/solar/Calculator.html, for an idea of how much they hinder the motion of earth. Needless to say we can safely ignore that effect on Earth's orbit. It would be safe to say collisions with space debris dwarf the contributions of photons to impeding the Earth's motion.
 
Last edited:
mfb said:
Technically: Sure. The energy density is 0.25 eV/cm3. For a rough approximation, assume Earth flies through space and picks up all photons "in front of it", re-emitting the energy isotropically. That is not true as the CMB photons move around, but that will just give some prefactor not far away from 1. Then Earth feels a radiation pressure of ##0.25 \frac{eV}{cm^3} \cdot 600 \frac{km}{s} \frac{1}{c} = 8\cdot 10^{-17} Pa## or a force of 32 mN. This leads to an acceleration of 5*10-27 m/s2. If Earth would freely float through the CMB, over 10 billion years this would change the speed of it by 1.7 nanometers per second. Yeah... forget it. To make it worse, Earth is not floating freely, it orbits the Sun. The column density of Sun is larger by a factor of about 100, so the effect on Sun is even smaller by a factor 100.

Ok, that is a very small effect indeed. Is there any scenario other than UHE cosmic rays where this drag would be worth considering? Interstellar or intergalactic dust or gas?
 
For the cosmic rays, it is not really a drag, it is just a conversion probability.

Repeating the same approach from above with 10-20 m2 atoms of 1 u, we get 5*10-10 m/s2 or a cooling time of 40 million years (as the force is proportional to speed). I don't trust the numbers enough to say if this is lower than a billion years, but a fast gas cloud far away from galaxies might actually experience some drag over time.
 
Thanks mfb and Chronos. I'm enjoying this lightsail calculator as well.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
4K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K
  • · Replies 70 ·
3
Replies
70
Views
7K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
7K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
3K
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
4K