Is this a valid argument about box topology?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the validity of an argument regarding convergence in box topology, particularly in the context of sequences in the product space R^ω. Participants explore the implications of the box topology's basis and how it relates to convergence of sequences and points.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents a sequence in R^ω where the coordinates converge to 0, arguing that the basis in box topology converges to a single set, which is not open, thus the sequence does not converge in box topology.
  • Another participant questions the definition of convergence being used, asking whether it refers to a sequence of sets or points, and clarifies that convergence in topology typically refers to sequences converging to points, not open sets.
  • A participant expresses uncertainty about terminology, seeking to differentiate between product topology and box topology, referencing a textbook argument about convergence and open sets in box topology.
  • One participant requests clearer questions and definitions, suggesting that quoting the textbook argument directly might help clarify the discussion.
  • Another participant challenges the notion of a basis converging, stating that convergence applies to sequences, nets, and filters, but not to bases, which adds to the confusion in the argument presented.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of convergence in topology, with no consensus reached on the validity of the initial argument regarding box topology. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing interpretations of convergence and the role of the basis.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the clarity of terms used, particularly regarding the definitions of convergence and the nature of bases in topology. The discussion reflects a need for precise terminology and understanding of the concepts involved.

Pippi
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Given the following sequence in the product space R^ω, such that the coordinates of x_n are 1/n,

x1 = {1, 1, 1, ...}
x2 = {1/2, 1/2, 1/2, ...}
x3 = {1/3, 1/3, 1/3, ...}
...

the basis in the box topology can be written as ∏(-1/n, 1/n). However, as n becomes infinitely large, the basis converges to ∏(0, 0), which is a single set and not open. Therefore the sequence is not convergent in box topology.

Since there exists a basis that converges to ∏(x, x), for any element x of R^ω, a sequence in box topology does not converge to any element in R^ω.
 
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Pippi said:
However, as n becomes infinitely large, the basis converges to ∏(0, 0), which is a single set and not open. Therefore the sequence is not convergent in box topology.

To have a basis B for R^\omega don't you need to be able to represent any set in R^\omega as a union of sets in B , not merely the sets that are near {0,0,...}?

What kind of convergence are you talking about? Are you talking about a sequence of sets or a sequence of points? Under the usual definition of convergence, a sequence of points in a toplogical space that converges will converge to a point. There is no requirement that it converge to an open set.
 
I don't know the right terminology. x_n represents a point in R^ω that has infinite number of coordinates. I want to use the sequence that if each of the coordinate converges as n grows large, x_n converges to a point.

I want to show the difference between product topology and box topology using the sequence x_n = {1/n, 1/, 1/n, ..., 1/n, ... }. A textbook argument, if I read correctly, says that because 1/n eventually goes to 0, there is no open set in the box topology that contains (-δ, δ) in R, hence no function converges. Am I on the right track?
 
To get a clear answer, you're going to have state a clear question. You mention a sequence of points and then you talk about a function converging without explaining what function you mean.

If there is a textbook argument, then quote the argument. Quote it, don't just give a mangled summary. (Perhaps the discipline of copying it will make it clearer to you.)
 
Thanks but no thank you. You are not being helpful at all.
 
Pippi said:
Thanks but no thank you. You are not being helpful at all.

That is because your question is a bit weird. What does it mean for a basis to converge?? The only things which can converge in topology are sequences, nets and filters. Things like basises can't converge. Except if you're talking about a filter basis, but even then the OP makes little sense.
 

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