Jesus Camp: A Movie That Will Make You Cry

[robertm]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3929535037535102662&q=Jesus+camp&ei=BKNISJTaL5yO4wLp4bigDA&hl=en"

I know there has been a lot of buzz around this movie already, however I thought I would share with you here...

Anything that can make a grown man cry is worth watching...

 

[Evo]

I'm moving this to politics.

I don't want anyone offended, so let me know if you are upset and explain why. I'm still watching all of it, it's a long documentary.

Any discussions should be restricted to the mix of religion and politics, the impact on Science, impacts on what our schools can teach. I will not allow conversations critisizing anyone's personal beliefs or disparaging religions.

 

[_Mayday_]

Can you give us a little sample of what it is about?

 

[Ivan Seeking]

"I want to see them [children] as radically laying down their lives for the gospel..."

"George Bush has brought credibility to the Christian faith"

"We've got to stand up and take back the land"

"I was saved when I was five. I wanted more from life"

I can't stand any more for now.

 

[robertm]

Sure, sorry I know it's long, and I'm almost put this in politics but I wasn't sure thanks Evo.

This is a documentary about an Evangelical Christian Bible camp for young kids. It unbiasedly shows the happenings at this camp and doesn't attempt to push any certain view. What is so sad is that by doing this the film shows how incredibly ------ these people are. In one scene they actually bring out a life-size cardboard cutout of Pres. Bush and made the children gather around it and and touch his feet like they were worshiping him. They dress the boy's up in army gear and give them fake guns and make them do a 'war dance' just like some radical Muslim's do with their kindergarteners.

But the worst part about this, the part that made me cry, is this very young incredibly intelligent boy who is trying so hard to 'feel the holy spirit' like all the other kids but can't (b/c the kids are obviously faking) and he is so torn and devastated because he believes that he is some sort of anti-Christ who is going straight to hell. AND NO ONE HELPS HIM. Not a single person can answer his heartfelt and sincere questions.

This is truly a very sad and terrifying and disgusting show case of what religion can become...

 

[Cyrus]

How do people get to be so igornant?

HAHAHAHHAH! THE LADY SAID TO THE KIDS "We have too many christian grown ups that are FAT AND LAZY!" ~7:00

Talk about the Pot calling the kettle black! Shes out of her f'in mind.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

How do people get to be so igornant?

They went to Jesus camp?

HAHAHAHHAH! THE LADY SAID TO THE KIDS "We have too many christian grown ups that are FAT AND LAZY!"

Talk about the Pot calling the kettle black!

I thought the same thing!

 

[waht]

There is probably many more camps like these scattered all over the states. These kids are send there by their parents who influence them with these ----- values.

 

[Cyrus]

They went to Jesus camp?



I thought the same thing!

This woman talking to her son is as nuts as a KKK member! YIKES!

 

[seycyrus]

There is probably many more camps like these scattered all over the states. These kids are send there by their parents who influence them with these wicked values.

No, there are NOT many more scattered ALL over.

It's an aberration and a terrible one. Don't use it to stereotype.

 

[Evo]

HAHAHAHHAH! THE LADY SAID TO THE KIDS "We have too many christian grown ups that are FAT AND LAZY!" ~7:00

That was rather funny, considering she must weigh over 300 pounds.

 

[AhmedEzz]

Extremism on every side...I think that's a valuable lesson for everyone who believes the one-sided media. Imagine what would you feel if someone tried to say that most Christians or
Americans are that ignorant and radical...ridiculous right? that's how I feel when I talk to some people who are heavily influenced by the media.

 

[Cyrus]

That was rather funny, considering she must weigh over 300 pounds.

How's this not child abuse? Can those kids minds even be salvaged after this?

 

[seycyrus]

Extremism on every side...I think that's a valuable lesson for everyone who believes the one-sided media. Imagine what would you feel if someone tried to say that most Christians or
Americans are that ignorant and radical...ridiculous right? that's how I feel when I talk to some people who are heavily influenced by the media.

Hi Ahmed.

I've had many discussions with muslims during my coffeshop excursions, so I understand that the radical views we see expressed by some are not representative of muslims as a whole.

The problem many people including myself have is that we do not see a public Muslim movement to censor and/or restrict the crazy beliefs of radical muslims.

 

[DT_tokamak]

How's this not child abuse? Can those kids minds even be salvaged after this?

Yeah, but it'll be tough for a lot of them. Beyond what damage is done already, what makes me really sad is they'll likely have to endure misteachings for many more years before they're in a position to think for themselves. And then the struggle will begin and that will probably take several more years.

 

[Evo]

Yeah, but it'll be tough for a lot of them. Beyond what damage is done already, what makes me really sad is they'll likely have to endure misteachings for many more years before they're in a position to think for themselves. And then the struggle will begin and that will probably take several more years.

The saddest part is that 75% of these kids are home schooled so that contact with normal people with normal viewpoints aren't even an option.

 

[Moonbear]

This is a documentary about an Evangelical Christian Bible camp for young kids. It unbiasedly shows the happenings at this camp and doesn't attempt to push any certain view.

I haven't watched any of it yet, but how do you know it's not biased or staged? There has been a trend for "shockumentaries" for a while now and I would hardly consider them unbiased or even accurate, so before I take the time to watch (since everyone is commenting on the length), I need more convincing that there's a reason to watch this or a reason to think the worst of the worst examples weren't staged or cherry-picked to make it seem worse than reality.

 

[Cyrus]

I haven't watched any of it yet, but how do you know it's not biased or staged? There has been a trend for "shockumentaries" for a while now and I would hardly consider them unbiased or even accurate, so before I take the time to watch (since everyone is commenting on the length), I need more convincing that there's a reason to watch this or a reason to think the worst of the worst examples weren't staged or cherry-picked to make it seem worse than reality.

Mmmmmmm yeah, you have to see it. It speaks for itself. Its very disturbing.

 

[robertm]

I haven't watched any of it yet, but how do you know it's not biased or staged? There has been a trend for "shockumentaries" for a while now and I would hardly consider them unbiased or even accurate, so before I take the time to watch (since everyone is commenting on the length), I need more convincing that there's a reason to watch this or a reason to think the worst of the worst examples weren't staged or cherry-picked to make it seem worse than reality.

It has parts where there is some commentary but the majority of the film is straight footage of the 'normal' life in the camp. I assure you none of this is staged, these crazy would be doing they same exact things whether or not there was a camera there. That is the unbiased, and the horrible, part.

 

[lisab]

My daughter just ordered this film on Netflix - we'll watch it tonight. All this discussion (about the film, not the other stuff) has whet my appetite!

 

[seycyrus]

Ok, I'm watching it and some parts of it are even worse than I imagined. it's the little things that bother me mostly, the one lady raising her kids hands for them for example.

The thing is, some parts of the message are relevant, if they were not being used in this setting.

P.S. When the fat lady talks about "Fat lazy Christians", she *is* intentionally referring to herself. She is telling the kids that it is up to them to change the world, that the previous generation failed.

 

[GeorginaS]

It has parts where there is some commentary but the majority of the film is straight footage of the 'normal' life in the camp. I assure you none of this is staged, these crazy would be doing they same exact things whether or not there was a camera there. That is the unbiased, and the horrible, part.

I haven't watched the film yet either, so I'll reserve any direct comment, but I echo Moonbear's concerns, robertm. Lack of commentary notwithstanding, how can you "assure" us that "none of this is staged"? How are you able to deliver those assurances? How do you know, for certain, that specific bits of footage haven't been spliced together in such a way as to deliver maximum and/or biased effect?

 

[seycyrus]

I haven't watched the film yet either, so I'll reserve any direct comment, but I echo Moonbear's concerns, robertm. Lack of commentary notwithstanding, how can you "assure" us that "none of this is staged"? How are you able to deliver those assurances? How do you know, for certain, that specific bits of footage haven't been spliced together in such a way as to deliver maximum and/or biased effect?

The troubling footage is continuous, not segmented.

After 7 pages of google hits I could not find a singe hit that suggested that it was faked.

 

[robertm]

Hhhhmmmm... I guess I can't assure, that maybe was the wrong language. However by watching individual scenes that simply show exactly what the people are saying, doing, and HAVE BEEN saying and doing you can come to a conclusion about the camp independent of what the producer's intentions were.

A few links so you can decide for yourself without watching:

Here is the movie site:
http://www.jesuscampthemovie.com/"

A short wiki page on Becky Fisher, who runs the "Kids on Fire" camp featured in the movie:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Becky_Fischer"

Kids on Fire was shut down do to negative reactions from this documetary. This is Fisher's new ministry:
http://www.kidsinministry.com/"

There are certain scenes in the movie witch cannot be portrayed in a biased manner, the simple fact is that regardless of what context, the people in the movie said and did the things they said and did. I urge you to watch the film and see for yourself. I cannot imagine that you will still disagree.

The picture of that poor little boy crying because he can not feel the holy spirit, is far more than enough for me to condemn these people. Their faith was literally tearing that boy's psyche apart, I can never forgive anyone for doing such an injustice to an innocent child.

 

[seycyrus]

This documentary would have been just as effective at exposing this lunacy without having to resort to the blatant political smear.

Show me some footage of some prominent republican's kids attending these camps before you start throwing down needless voiceovers.

 

[robertm]

Agreed seycyrus, one really should just skip the commentary sections and watch the camp footage, it speaks for itself.

 

[mcknia07]

I watched a few, and I couldn't believe what I was seeing...

 

[phyzmatix]

Poor kids...

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Extremism on every side...I think that's a valuable lesson for everyone who believes the one-sided media. Imagine what would you feel if someone tried to say that most Christians or Americans are that ignorant and radical...ridiculous right? that's how I feel when I talk to some people who are heavily influenced by the media.

Many Americans understand that. And I think that a great deal of progress has been made in educating the public about Islam. And to his credit, even Bush stated that we are in war with radicals and not everyone in or from the Middle East.

The real problem that we have in this regard are our own religious radicals. Unfortunately they have had far too much political influence in recent years. But hopefully that has run its course; we will put the nuts back in the can, and we can all start to move beyond this as a global community.

 

[jostpuur]

Anyone knowing facts about the how things are progressing? Is this extreme Christianity growing or not?

 

[Evo]

Anyone knowing facts about the how things are progressing? Is this extreme Christianity growing or not?

There does seem to have been in increase in the past few years. It's hard to put a number to them as they don't tend to list themselves as fanatics.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I have seen a number of stories that show that many fundamentalist groups have rejected their extremist ministers and brought in people who have a more traditional message. One guy who had a church following of thousands is now holding meetings at a Motel 6 or the like. The congregation asked him to leave after I think nearly twenty years.

Not long ago I posted one of those stories somewhere around here...

 

[Moonbear]

The troubling footage is continuous, not segmented.

That could just be very good video editing.

After 7 pages of google hits I could not find a singe hit that suggested that it was faked.

That just means the people watching are buying the claims, not that they are real.

Sorry, I just have to be skeptical anymore. There are just too many things out claiming to be documentaries that really aren't to just assume I can trust any of them at face value. I already know there are religious fanatics, so what could this add that makes it worth watching, or what gives it credence that it's not just another anti-religion or political statement. Just from what people are posting here, it sounds highly biased, so I don't understand the claims that it is unbiased. There are plenty of Christian summer camps and youth camps and retreats that would NEVER consider anything so bizarre as kissing the feet of a Bush cut-out figure, so what is the significance of a documentary portraying an odd one that does if not to bias people against religion?

 

[robertm]

Moonbear, I care not what the original purpose of the documentary was, when I saw the footage of that poor young boy crying his heart out b/c he thought he was the anti-christ that was plenty. I ask you how you would propose faking that?

If you don't want to watch the movie then don't, and maybe it is biased and it does certainly pose a political standpoint.

However, negating all the politics, the images and the things that literally come out of these peoples mouths are very powerful and very sad.

 

[jostpuur]

In the document one guy explained that he is a God believing person, and believes that there is a "special place" (he was talking about Hell) for those (the camp instructors) who mess with our children. The over all atmosphere didn't seem anti-religious to me.

In one scene a little girl criticizes ordinary churches for not being fanatic enough, claiming that the God is not present in boring churches like that.