Klein-Gordon Momentum Question

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    Klein-gordon Momentum
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the derivation of the momentum operator in the context of the Klein-Gordon field theory. Participants explore the relationship between the momentum operator and the creation and annihilation operators, as well as the implications of using time derivatives in the calculations.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents a definition of the momentum operator and attempts to express it in terms of the operators \( a_n \) and \( a^{\dagger}_n \).
  • Another participant suggests that the classical momentum should be expressed as a function of the field \( \phi \), the canonical momentum field \( \Pi \), and their spatial derivatives, rather than time derivatives.
  • A different participant calculates the time derivative of \( \phi \) and discusses setting \( t = 0 \) to simplify the integration, but expresses uncertainty about further simplification.
  • One participant questions the validity of using time derivatives in the Heisenberg picture and recommends starting from the classical formula for momentum before promoting fields to operators.
  • Another participant agrees that using either \( \Pi \) or \( \dot{\phi} \) should not affect the Hamiltonian, but suggests rewriting sums in \( \phi \) to simplify the expression, while also noting a potential relationship between \( a_{-n} \) and \( a^{\dagger}_n \) for the reality of \( \phi \).

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the appropriate approach to deriving the momentum operator, with some advocating for classical formulations while others focus on operator methods. No consensus is reached on the best method or the implications of using time derivatives.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight potential limitations in their approaches, including the dependence on definitions and the unresolved nature of certain mathematical steps, particularly regarding the treatment of time derivatives.

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Dear all, I'd be very grateful for some help on this question:

"The momentum operator is defined by: [tex]\displaystyle P = - \int_{0}^{L} dz \left(\frac{\partial \phi}{\partial t}\right) \left( \frac{\partial \phi}{\partial z} \right)[/tex]

Show that P can be written in terms of the operators [tex]a_n[/tex] and [tex]a^{\dagger}_n[/tex] as:

[tex]\displaystyle P = \sum_{n} k_n a_n^{\dagger} a_n[/tex] "

The KG field is given by: [tex]\displaystyle \phi(t,z) = \sum_{n} \frac{1}{\sqrt{2E_n L}} \left[a_n e^{-i(E_n t - k_n z)} + a^{\dagger}_n e^{+i(E_n t - k_n z)} \right][/tex]

The following relations are true:
[tex]\displaystyle k_n = \frac{2 \pi n}{L} \;;\; \left[a_n, a_m^{\dagger} \right] = \delta_{nm} \;;\; \left[a_n, a_m \right] = \left[a_n^{\dagger}, a_m^{\dagger} \right] = 0[/tex]

and [tex]E_n^2 = k_n^2 + m^2[/tex]

[tex]\displaystyle \int_{0}^{L} dz e^{iz(k_n-k_m)} = L \delta_{nm}[/tex]

----------------------

I've fed all this information into the definition of the momentum operator and have the result:

[tex]\displaystyle P = \sum_{n} \frac{k_n}{2} \left[1 + 2 a_n^{\dagger} a_n - a_n a_{-n} - a^{\dagger}_n a^{\dagger}_{-n} \right][/tex]

but I am unsure of how to reduce this down even further.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
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How did you deal with the time derivative [tex]\frac{\partial\phi}{\partial t}[/tex]? You should first solve the classical momentum to be a function of [tex]\phi[/tex], the canonical momenta field [tex]\Pi[/tex], and possibly their spatial derivatives but not time derivatives.

You already have the operator [tex]\phi[/tex] written in terms of [tex]a_n[/tex] and [tex]a_n^{\dagger}[/tex]. (I don't think the Heisenberg picture time evolution is relevant now. Operators with fixed time should be enough.) There exists similar formula for the operator [tex]\Pi[/tex]. You get the momentum operator in terms of [tex]a_n[/tex] and [tex]a_n^{\dagger}[/tex] when you substitute the formulas for operators [tex]\phi[/tex] and [tex]\Pi[/tex].
 
I worked the time derivative out to be:

[tex]\displaystyle \frac{\partial \phi}{\partial t} = - i \sum_n \sqrt{\frac{E_n}{2L}} \left[ a_n e^{-i(E_n t - k_n z)} - a_n^{\dagger} e^{+i(E_n t - k_n z)} \right][/tex]

Whilst integrating the whole expression I set t = 0 to remove the time dependence (as seems to be the trick played in a few books I've read) and used the orthogonality between the complex exponentials to arrive at were I'm stuck.
 
I'm not sure what happens when you compute time derivatives of the operators in Heisenberg picture like that. It could be that you can get correct answer, but I wouldn't count on it. If it gives the correct result, IMO it should be proven as a result of its own. Anyway, I would suggest using the classical formula

[tex] P=-\int dx\; \Pi(x)\nabla\phi(x)[/tex]

for momentum in start. You get the momentum operator when you promote [tex]\phi[/tex] and [tex]\Pi[/tex] to operators.

You don't struggle with quantization of quantity [tex]\dot{x}[/tex] in single particle QM either. Instead the quantities are written as functions of position [tex]x[/tex] and canonical momenta [tex]p[/tex], and the position and the canonical momenta are promoted to become operators then.
 
Whether you use [tex]\Pi[/tex] or [tex]\dot\phi[/tex] I don't think it'll affect the Hamiltonian that you calculate, so I think your method is correct. I don't know if you've made any mistakes getting to that point, however, another useful trick is to rewrite the sums in [tex]\phi[/tex] as a single sum (after getting rid of time dependence), by replacing [tex]a_{n}[/tex] with [tex]a_{-n}[/tex] and factoring out the exponential.

Also, for [tex]\phi[/tex] to be real, I recall that [tex]a_{-n}[/tex] = [tex]a^\dagger_n[/tex], but you'll have to check this, as I'm prone to talking out of my ass =)
 

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