Maximum acceleration of an alpha particle?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on estimating the maximum acceleration of an alpha particle during backscattering by a heavy atom, particularly in the context of Rutherford backscattering. Participants explore both classical and quantum mechanical perspectives, focusing on the order of magnitude rather than precise values.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes an estimate for the maximum acceleration of a 5.4 MeV alpha particle, derived from equating kinetic energy to electrostatic potential energy and calculating the acceleration at the closest approach to the nucleus.
  • Another participant questions the validity of using a classical approach, suggesting that the wave nature of the alpha particle complicates the concept of acceleration, particularly at small distances.
  • A later reply emphasizes the relevance of the wave formulation, noting that the transformation from wave to particle may influence when acceleration can be meaningfully defined.
  • One participant raises a question about the applicability of the wave formulation in the context of alpha particles produced within the human body, seeking to understand the conditions under which acceleration becomes relevant.
  • Another participant inquires about the focus on alpha particles rather than beta particles, pointing out differences in initial conditions for acceleration calculations.
  • Participants discuss the implications of the initial speed of the alpha particle in alpha decay compared to beta decay, highlighting the challenges in estimating acceleration in different decay processes.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the appropriateness of classical versus quantum mechanical approaches to estimating acceleration. There is no consensus on how to define or calculate maximum acceleration in this context, and the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants note limitations in their estimates, including assumptions about the nature of the alpha particle and the conditions under which wave-like properties become significant. The discussion also highlights the complexity of defining acceleration in quantum mechanical terms.

Orthoceras
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TL;DR
Maximum acceleration of an alpha particle that is backscattered by a heavy atom?
I would like to estimate the maximum acceleration (or deceleration) of an alpha particle that is backscattered by a heavy atom, like in Rutherford backscattering. I am interested in the order of magnitude, not in a precise value. I am assuming the collision is elastic.

The kinetic energy of the free alpha particle is E. The closest distance of the alpha particle to the atom's nucleus, r_0, is found by equating E to the electrostatic potential energy: E = \frac{f q Q}{r_0} \Rightarrow r_0 = \frac{f q Q}{E}
The acceleration (or deceleration) at r = r_0, due to the repulsive Coulomb force, is: a_0 = \frac{F}{m} = \frac{f q Q}{{r_0}^2 m} = \frac{f q Q}{\left(\frac{f q Q}{E}\right)^2 m} = \frac{E^2}{f q Q m}

For example, if the alpha particle was generated by the decay of Po-210, with E=5.4 MeV, and the scattering nucleus is heavy compared to the alpha particle (for example, another polonium atom) then r_0 = 4⋅10^{-14} m and a_0 = 3⋅10^{27} \frac{m}{s^2}

However, I suppose a quantum mechanical wave does not have an acceleration, so r should be at least 10 times the de Broglie wavelength (assuming the de Broglie wavelength of a particle indicates the length scale at which wave-like properties are important for that particle). I tried a few r values and found that r=10 \lambda_{Broglie} at r=1.7 r_0. Then the acceleration is a = 1⋅10^{27} \frac{m}{s^2}. That is my estimate for the order of magnitude of the maximum acceleration of this 5.4 MeV alpha particle.

Is this a somewhat valid estimate?
 
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Orthoceras said:
However, I suppose a quantum mechanical wave does not have an acceleration, so r should be at least 10 times the de Broglie wavelength (assuming the de Broglie wavelength of a particle indicates the length scale at which wave-like properties are important for that particle). I tried a few r values and found that r=10 \lambda_{Broglie} at r=1.7 r_0. Then the acceleration is a = 1⋅10^{27} \frac{m}{s^2}. That is my estimate for the order of magnitude of the maximum acceleration of this 5.4 MeV alpha particle.

Is this a somewhat valid estimate?

An edit of that paragraph, to provide more clarity and correct a mistake:

However, the speed is zero at r=r_0, so the de Broglie wavelength is infinite, the alpha particle is a quantum mechanical wave, and I suppose a wave does not have an acceleration. Assuming the de Broglie wavelength of a particle indicates the length scale at which wave-like properties are important for that particle, r should be at least 10 times the de Broglie wavelength. The de Broglie wavelength is \lambda=\frac{h}{p} and p=\sqrt{2 m (E-\frac{kqQ}{r})}. Then r\approx 10\, \lambda at r=2 r_0, and the acceleration is a = \left(\frac{r0}{r}\right)^2a_0 = 0.7⋅10^{27} \frac{m}{s^2}. That is my estimate for the order of magnitude of the maximum acceleration of this 5.4 MeV alpha particle.

Is this a somewhat valid estimate?
 
You are looking for an order of magnitude estimate. I don't understand why you are not content with the particle formulation of the answer. Why bother with the wave formulation in which you know that "maximum acceleration" is an ill-defined concept?
 
I bother with the wave formulation because of the next question. I was actually curious about the highest acceleration of objects present in our environment. The average human body contains 0.1 femtogram op Po-210, with an activity of 20 Bq, so many 5.4 MeV alpha particles are produced all the time inside us. The calculation of the maximum acceleration is the same as the one I used for Rutherford backscattering.

In this new case the wave is the initial form of the alpha particle, so it can't be ignored. My question is, at which distance do they transform from wave to particle, so at which distance is the concept of acceleration applicable? Would that be when r\approx 10\, \lambda, or at its first recoil action on the nucleus, or at its first interaction with an electron of the atom?

Even though an exact "maximum acceleration" is an ill-defined concept, I would expect that it should somehow be possible to estimate the order of magnitude.
 
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Why are you considering alphas and not betas?
 
In alpha decay, the initial speed of the particle is known, it is zero. In beta decay, the initial speed is unknown. As a result I was able to calculate the initial acceleration of the particle in alpha decay, but not in beta decay..

Also, Rutherford has shown that an alpha particle is able to penetrate the atom as a projectile. An electron that penetrates an atom is less simple.
 
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