Maxwell's Demon: Is it Worth the Read?

[DB]

Maxwell's Demon by Hans Christian and Von Baeyer, for those who've read it, is it worth reading?

 

[ramollari]

Maybe I'm wrong, but why to read a whole book for the Maxwell's demon?

 

[chronon]

Maxwell's Demon by Hans Christian and Von Baeyer, for those who've read it, is it worth reading?

I haven't read this book but I have read his book 'Information: The New Langauge of Science'. I felt that this was definitely worth reading, but at the start he seemed to be trying to show how difficult the subject was. Possibly his other book is similar, so I would say that even if the first chapter seems a bit daunting then you should stick with it.

Notes:
1)Hans Christian Von Baeyer is all one name

2)When I first looked at your post with what seemed like 2 authors, it thought it referred to Maxwell's demon 2 : entropy, classical and quantum information, computing / edited by Harvey S. Leff and Andrew F. Rex., but that's a different book altogether - its a collection of papers about Maxwell's demon, and I would only advise it for those who are keen on finding out about the history of the subject.

 

[DB]

oops my mistake, its just that von baeyer was under hans christian.

 

[lyapunov]

Maybe I'm wrong, but why to read a whole book for the Maxwell's demon?

I'd suggest several even (well, at least one). It's a very, very informative experiment to get a grip on entropy, if that's at all possible. Took quite some time for someone to really refute the original logic, too (Szilard).

http://users.ntsource.com/~neilsen/papers/demon/dpaper.html

 

[ramollari]

I'd suggest several even (well, at least one). It's a very, very informative experiment to get a grip on entropy, if that's at all possible. Took quite some time for someone to really refute the original logic, too (Szilard).

http://users.ntsource.com/~neilsen/papers/demon/dpaper.html

I don't have anything against the subject, honestly it is among the most interesting ones. I have read about the Maxwell's daemon in a chapter of an entertaining book from G.Gamov, and I think a few pages would be enough. Maybe the interested reader would like to know more.

 

[lyapunov]

I have read about the Maxwell's daemon in a chapter of an entertaining book from G.Gamov, and I think a few pages would be enough.

Let me guess: The New World of Mr. Tompkins ...

nice, but hardly thorough or extensive.

 

[ramollari]

Yes, you got it!

 

[lyapunov]

Yes, you got it!

Thought so.


Thing is though, that entropy is not only something related to energy, but to information as well. There are subtle differences, some pretty hard to grasp. Therefore I'd suggest to anyone really reading up on MD, because it is one of the rare instances where the two types (energy and information) meet.

And entropy plays an enormous - albeit somewhat hidden - role in just about everything we do. It keeps us sane, for one - through forgetting. Even if we don't really forget, but no longer focus on something - essentially because we do no longer wish to put in so much effort (energy) into something bad or that's gone wrong in the past.

Something much overlooked in A.I. circles, too.

 

[ramollari]

Entropy v Forgetting
What is the relationship?

 

[chronon]

Entropy v Forgetting
What is the relationship?

Well suppose you turn off your computer. The information in it is lost (forgotten) due to dispersion of the energy of the system to the environment - the increase of entropy.

So I've told you how entropy is really the same as forgetting. Well, now you should forget it, because I'm going to tell you the exact opposite

When Maxwell's demon finds out the position of a particle he has gained some information. To reset the system to its original state he has to get rid of this information. But since physics is reversible he has no mechanism for doing this. If he could then we could build Maxwell's demon type devices. Thus the second law of thermodynamics rests on the fact that no information is ever truly forgotten.

 

[lyapunov]

Entropy v Forgetting
What is the relationship?

As Chronon indicated, trickier than you might think, he?

see also: (scroll down to 'A reset operation')

http://www.demog.berkeley.edu/~dstein/complexity/maxwellsdemon.html

and to get a glimpse of others struggling with the concepts:

http://preposterousuniverse.blogspo...erousuniverse_archive.html#107902422397882490