News Palin pick an insult to our intelligence

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The discussion centers on the impact of Sarah Palin's selection as the vice-presidential candidate for John McCain's campaign. Initial reactions highlighted her appeal to women, but the conversation quickly shifted to criticisms of her qualifications and the controversies surrounding her, such as her daughter's pregnancy and various ethical issues. Despite these controversies, many supporters remained loyal, attributing her popularity to her charisma and ability to connect with conservative values. Critics argue that her lack of substantial experience and knowledge in complex political matters undermines her candidacy. The dialogue also touches on the broader implications of the election process, suggesting that it has devolved into a popularity contest rather than a serious evaluation of candidates' qualifications and policies. Participants express frustration over the perceived ignorance of voters who support candidates based on superficial traits rather than substantive issues, leading to concerns about the future of democracy and informed decision-making in elections.
  • #361
turbo-1 said:
There is plenty of information for CNN, although apparently it hasn't filtered into the "news" that you subscribe to.
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/09/21/palin.rape.exams/?iref=hpmostpop

It would seem that the people in Alaska are deluded in thinking that there was any problem at all. Yet ...
CNN said:
"It was one of those things everyone could agree on except Wasilla," Croft told CNN. "We couldn't convince the chief of police to stop charging them."
So to overcome that hardline mean-spiritedness in Wasilla, the State Legislature mandated payment for rape kits. AS 18.68.040
 
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  • #362
I remember when it was left for the states to decide. Only New York and California allowed abortions. (This was my freshman English essay "A case for Abortion in the United States").

What happened was that only the wealthy could afford to fly across country to get abortions and all the rest were left to botched self abortions, back street abortions, or suicide. The death and mutilation of women and young girls trying to abort without legal medical assistance was horrendous. Not to mention damage to fetuses that did not abort.

Is this what we want to go back to? Coat hanger abortions? Do we want women forced into barbaric illegal abortions? Because you know what? Making abortions illegal doesn't stop abortions, it just forces women and girls into potentially deadly situations.

It's time for all of the pro-lifers that think if abortion is illegal, something magical and wonderful is going to happen to get a clue.

I went to school with girls that had illegal abortions and I will always blame the people that made it illegal for what happened to them.

I lived through that time, I doubt that many here that are against abortion lived through that.

All a strict pro-lifer will say is that they shouldn't have the abortions in the first place. True pro-lifers will "walk-the-walk" so-to-speak, but I still think it is ultimately wrong to force the woman to have the child. It is for these reasons that I am pro-choice for the first trimester.

If they weren't provided there would be no charges now would there. And if they weren't provided and no contraceptive was offered there wouldn't be any charges for that either.

The rape kits are provided, but the question is would they have billed the victim for them. There is no solid evidence that they did this whatsoever. According to this, the police department is not who bills the victim, it is the hospital; the police department can offer to pay for it, but it is ultimately the hospital that makes the decision regarding who will pay the bill:

http://www.legis.state.ak.us/basis/...4&session=21&comm=STA&date=20000309&time=0820

There was also the State of Alaska Violent Crimes Compensation Board (VCCB): http://www.state.ak.us/local/akpages/ADMIN/vccb/info.html

So IF some hospital decided to bill the victim, the VCCB should have paid for it.

Since Chief Fallon mentioned a specific expense burden then he was either lying that those expenses exist, or those expenses are buried in office supplies or some other spurious account.

He said he didn't want the city to pay for it, but he also said he didn't want the victim to either. The media are obviously distorting the facts.

So to overcome that hardline mean-spiritedness in Wasilla, the State Legislature mandated payment for rape kits. AS 18.68.040

In the transcript, it is clear that the committee was concerned about hospitals, not police departments, and not Sarah Palin.

This isn't about Obama. We're talking about Palin's lack of experience and her unsuitability for the office.

You can't criticize the one without bringing up the alternative choice right now. If this was prior to McCain's VP selection, and it could be Palin, Romney, Pawlenty, etc...then yes, it would be pointless to bring up Senator Obama.

GIBSON: What insight into Russian actions, particularly in the last couple of weeks, does the proximity of the state give you?

PALIN: They’re our next door neighbors and you can actually see Russia from land here in Alaska, from an island in Alaska.

Yes, and then ABC news in the televised interview cut the rest of what was said regarding Russia:

GIBSON: What insight does that give you into what they’re doing in Georgia?

PALIN: Well, I’m giving you that perspective of how small our world is and how important it is that we work with our allies to keep good relation with all of these countries, especially Russia. We will not repeat a Cold War. We must have good relationship with our allies, pressuring, also, helping us to remind Russia that it’s in their benefit, also, a mutually beneficial relationship for us all to be getting along.

We cannot repeat the Cold War. We are thankful that, under Reagan, we won the Cold War, without a shot fired, also. We’ve learned lessons from that in our relationship with Russia, previously the Soviet Union.

We will not repeat a Cold War. We must have good relationship with our allies, pressuring, also, helping us to remind Russia that it’s in their benefit, also, a mutually beneficial relationship for us all to be getting along.
 
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  • #363
More insite into Palin's sleazy political tactics.

Sarah Palin has a way of using "old boys" -- then dumping them when they become inconvenient.

Sept. 23, 2008 | WASILLA, Alaska --The Wasilla mayor's seat is nonpartisan, and Mayor Stein, a former city planner who had held the post for nine years, ran a businesslike campaign that stressed his experience and competency. But Palin ignited the traditionally low-key race with scorching social issues, injecting "God, guns and abortion into the race -- things that had nothing to do with being mayor of a small town," according to Tigner.

Palin's mayoral campaign rode the wave of conservative, evangelical fervor that was sweeping Alaska in the '90s. Suddenly candidates' social values, not their ability to manage the roads and sewer systems, were dominating the debate. "Sarah and I were both Republicans, but this was an entirely new slant to local politics -- much more aggressive than anything I'd ever seen," said Stein, looking back at the election that put Palin on the political map.

There was a knife-sharp, personal edge to Palin's campaign that many locals found disturbing, particularly because of the warm relationship between Palin and Stein before the race.

"I called Sarah's campaign for mayor the end of the age of innocence in Wasilla," said Carney.

Even though Palin knew that Stein is a Protestant Christian, from a Pennsylvania Dutch background, her campaign began circulating the word that she would be "Wasilla's first Christian mayor." Some of Stein's supporters interpreted this as an attempt to portray Stein as Jewish in the heavily evangelical community. Stein himself, an eminently reasonable and reflective man, thinks "they were redefining Christianity to mean born-agains."

The Palin campaign also started another vicious whisper campaign, spreading the word that Stein and his wife -- who had chosen to keep her own last name when they were married -- were not legally wed. Again, Palin knew the truth, Stein said, but chose to muddy the waters. "We actually had to produce our marriage certificate," recalled Stein, whose wife died of breast cancer in 2005 without ever reconciling with Palin.


"I had a hand in creating Sarah, but in the end she blew me out of the water," Stein said, sounding more wearily ironic than bitter. "Sarah's on a mission, she's an opportunist."

According to some political observers in Alaska, this pattern -- exploiting "old-boy" mentors and then turning against them for her own advantage -- defines Sarah Palin's rise to power. Again and again, Palin has charmed powerful political patrons, and then rejected them when it suited her purposes. She has crafted a public image as a clean politics reformer, but in truth, she has only blown the whistle on political corruption when it was expedient for her to do so. Above all, Palin is a dynamo of ambition, shrewdly maneuvering her way through the notoriously compromised world of Alaska politics, making and breaking alliances along the way.

"When Palin takes credit for knocking off the old-boy network in Alaska, it drives me crazy," said Andrew Halcro, an Anchorage businessman and radio talk show host who ran against her in the 2006 GOP primary race for governor. "Sarah certainly availed herself of that network whenever it was expedient."

Continued...

Palin's reputation as a reformer stems primarily from her headline-grabbing ouster of state GOP chairman Randy Ruedrich from the Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission for flagrant conflict-of-interest abuses. At the time, Palin was heralded in the press as a whistle-blower, but it was later revealed that she was guilty of the same charge that she had brought against Ruedrich -- using state office equipment for partisan political business. (While still mayor of Wasilla, she sent out campaign fundraising appeals from her office during her race for lieutenant governor.)

Others suspect that Palin had self-serving reasons for taking on Ruedrich and resigning her seat on the commission. The state energy panel had ignited a public firestorm in Palin's home base, Mat-Su Valley, by secretly leasing sub-surface drilling rights on thousands of residential lots to a Colorado-based gas producer. Outraged farmers and homeowners, who woke up one morning to find drilling equipment being hauled onto their land, were in open revolt against the commission. While Palin initially supported the leasing plan, she was shrewd enough to realize it was political suicide to alienate conservative property owners in her own district. According to some accounts, she was also growing tired of commuting to state offices in Anchorage and poring over dry, tedious technical manuals for her job. All in all, it seemed like the right move to jump ship -- and going out a hero was an added plus.

"Sarah quit the commission to make political hay," Halcro asserted.

"The idea that Sarah shook up the state's old-boy network is one big fantasy, it's complete bull****," Halcro said. "She got all this public acclaim for throwing people who backed her under the bus -- but she only did it after they became expendable, when she no longer needed them.

Continued...

http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2008/09/23/palin/index1.html
 
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  • #364
WheelsRCool said:
There is no solid evidence that they did this whatsoever.

Of course there is. The news accounts and the statement of the police chief at the time make it quite clear that there was a conscious policy initiative to make the victims pay. Why else would Fallon have said what he did? Are you saying that he was lying? And for what purpose was he lying if they were already paying and had no intention of ever charging?

Yes, and then ABC news in the televised interview cut the rest of what was said regarding Russia:

You mean Gibson was so aware of how downright pitiful her answer was that he had to ask a follow up in which she goes on to reveal her cartoon like understanding of foreign affairs?

Maybe she should just stick to watching her sunsets over Siberia?
 
  • #365
Evo said:
More insite into Palin's sleazy political tactics.

http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2008/09/23/palin/index1.html

Hmmm. Who's left to throw under Machiavelli's bus? Who else in the "Old Boys Hall of Fame" stands between her ambition and the Presidency?

But maybe its all ok because she sees herself as on a mission from God?

Reverend Muthee holding East Wing Exorcisms after the Easter Egg hunt on the South Lawn??
 
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  • #366
The McCain campaign wants to insulate Palin from ALL reporting, and have banned reporters (print, TV, radio) from covering Palin's UN visit. They are allowing one CNN producer to accompany the camera-operator. That's it. Apparently, Sarah is seen as a bit of a loose cannon, because the campaign has refused to allow any reporters to question her as she makes public appearances.

http://blogs.abcnews.com/theworldnewser/2008/09/sarah-palin-mee.html
 
  • #367
turbo-1 said:
The McCain campaign wants to insulate Palin from ALL reporting, and have banned reporters (print, TV, radio) from covering Palin's UN visit. They are allowing one CNN producer to accompany the camera-operator. That's it. Apparently, Sarah is seen as a bit of a loose cannon, because the campaign has refused to allow any reporters to question her as she makes public appearances.

http://blogs.abcnews.com/theworldnewser/2008/09/sarah-palin-mee.html
One of those times you'd like to be a fly on the wall.

Will this CNN person be able to write, or will they have to memorize everything?

This is so ridiculous. They are so afraid that she's going to make a complete fool of herself that they don't want anyone to see it.

Talk about waving a big red flag over their VP pick. :biggrin:
 
  • #368
An alternative intelligent design incorporating evolution is here:
http://www.urantia.org/papers/paper58.html
http://www.urantia.org/papers/paper65.html

-Thats to help WheelsRCool a little, I agree with nothing else he has posted though.

Palin, I'm sure, will destroy McCains chances as the home stretch approaches. She has too many skeletons coming into the light.
 
  • #369
Evo said:
One of those times you'd like to be a fly on the wall.

Will this CNN person be able to write, or will they have to memorize everything?

This is so ridiculous. They are so afraid that she's going to make a complete fool of herself that they don't want anyone to see it.

Talk about waving a big red flag over their VP pick. :biggrin:
Reminds me of the M*A*S*H when a general says "This is a press conference. The last thing we want to do is answer a lot of questions". :biggrin:
 
  • #370
Palin press may boycott UN conference
http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20080923/pl_politico/13783
NEW YORK – Journalists, displeased with Sarah Palin’s efforts to restrict their access to her, are threatening not to cover her events surrounding the United Nations conference here unless they're allowed more access.

The unfolding boycott is the latest development in a rocky relationship between Palin’s handlers and the press, in which the campaign has sought to tightly control her interactions with the media.

The campaign had originally indicated that the print reporters following her campaign would be among the small group of journalists allowed to attend the so-called “pool sprays” before Palin’s meetings with dignitaries on the sidelines of the U.N. meetings.

The sprays are basically glorified photo opportunities during which journalists can snap photos and film footage and – if they’re lucky – shout a question or two at Palin and her company before she adjourns for private meetings.
. . . . .
Pool sprays?! Sounds rather superficial and unsubstantive. This is what we get from those who would be national leaders?
 
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  • #371
Astronuc said:
Palin press may boycott UN conference
http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20080923/pl_politico/13783
Pool sprays?! Sounds rather superficial and unsubstantive. This is what we get from those who would be national leaders?

Yes in this campaign the less they let her say the better. I think they are scared to death she will open her mouth. Look at the fallout from the Gibson interview where I think she just came off as totally unfit to hold the office.

November can't come too soon. No telling when another Reverend Muthee will jump out of the woodwork.
 
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  • #372
Apparently under Palin's reign Wasilla has been turned into an environmental kill zone.

http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2008/09/19/palin/index.html

This is apparently her philosophy for ANWR too no doubt. Scrape the land bare and suck it dry and to h-e-double hockey sticks with the polar bears?
 
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  • #373
Of course there is. The news accounts and the statement of the police chief at the time make it quite clear that there was a conscious policy initiative to make the victims pay. Why else would Fallon have said what he did? Are you saying that he was lying? And for what purpose was he lying if they were already paying and had no intention of ever charging?

I do not know. Maybe he was. But as of now there is no evidence whatsoever that any victims were billed, and as I have shown, according to the committee, it wasn't the police department that even does the billing, it's the hospitals.

You mean Gibson was so aware of how downright pitiful her answer was that he had to ask a follow up in which she goes on to reveal her cartoon like understanding of foreign affairs?

Maybe she should just stick to watching her sunsets over Siberia?

She answered it in a manner where she clearly expected him to follow-up. If you consider it to have been "cartoon-like," then I would have to say some of the foreign-policy proposals of Senator Obama have been Tom and Jerry cartoons.

This is so ridiculous. They are so afraid that she's going to make a complete fool of herself that they don't want anyone to see it.

Talk about waving a big red flag over their VP pick.

Or maybe it is because the media has shown itself to clearly be out to get Governor Palin. I don't remember them being even near this eager over Senator Obama. They were just as hostile to Hillary Clinton as well.

However, I still think they should allow Governor Palin to talk to the media. If the media are more hostile to one particular candidate, well you just have to go with it.

But guys, you think it doesn't send a big red flag over the Democratic Presidential candidate himself in that he decided to stop debating Hillary after he did poorly in the ABC debate (he had no problem when the debates were clearly biased in his favor). Or that he said he'd debate McCain in townhall debates but has yet too...?

That says something as well.

Obama should not be resistant to debate McCain in some townhalls I think, and Palin should not be resistent to answering some media questions.
 
  • #374
WheelsRCool said:
But as of now there is no evidence whatsoever that any victims were billed, and as I have shown, according to the committee, it wasn't the police department that even does the billing, it's the hospitals.

You surely are an anxious revisionist. They no longer have the records from 6 years ago, the Alaska Law that came down prohibiting the Wasilla actions reported her policy at the time, and made it mandatory that municipalities didn't charge the victims. Now your strategy of denial wants to suggest that because records may no longer be readily available, and in spite of the reports at the time from her hand picked police chief, that Palin couldn't have neither known about it nor would have done it? This must be like one of those "verbiage" moments that she likes to retreat behind.
Or maybe it is because the media has shown itself to clearly be out to get Governor Palin.
Or maybe its because she has such limited experience and such vapid valley-girl like explanations to things that they think surely there is more depth there than the shallowness on display and they want to help her get more exposure?
Or that he said he'd debate McCain in townhall debates but has yet too...?
That's a pretty disingenuous response. Either you are trying to be guileful or you are ignorant of the debates that are scheduled. The second Presidential debate is specifically styled as a Town Hall debate.
 
  • #375
McCain came off OK in his "town-hall" meetings because the crowds were favorable to him, AND they were salted with people who were primed to ask questions that played to his strengths. Obama was wise not to play into that, and to stick with debates in which there might be some semblance of fairness and substance.
 
  • #376
I saw a clip of Palin talking to Iraq's PM (?). He appeared bemused and she looked like she was trying to APPEAR interested and able to follow his convo. (Doesn't he have an accent?)
 
  • #377
I'm wondering (sort of) why Palin - who is supposed to be COMPETENT and ABLE to assume the office if McCain doesn't hold up - is not mingling with the press/media the way Biden is? D'OH, I forgot she's saving it up for the finish line. :confused::rolleyes:
 
  • #378
Amp1 said:
I'm wondering (sort of) why Palin - who is supposed to be COMPETENT and ABLE to assume the office if McCain doesn't hold up - is not mingling with the press/media the way Biden is? D'OH, I forgot she's saving it up for the finish line. :confused::rolleyes:

They were talking about this on the radio this morning. Apparently the McCain campaign are trying to keep the media away from Palin and they are rather upset about it.
 
  • #379
I wonder what people would think of Palin if she said,
"Part of what a leader does is to instill confidence... is demonstrate that he or she knows what they're talking about and communicates to people "If you listen to me and follow what I'm suggesting, we can fix this." You know when the stock market crashed, Franklin Roosevelt got on television and didn't just talk about the, you know, the princes of greed, he said "Look, here's what happened..."

Now that would be priceless, yes?
 
  • #380
chemisttree said:
I wonder what people would think of Palin if she said,

Now that would be priceless, yes?

They would certainly laugh at her for suggesting that she would have the gravitas to manage a situation much more complicated than a Wasilla pot luck social.

On the other hand Joe Biden could certainly expect to execute more ably in the office that Palin's unthrottled ambition would aspire to.
 
  • #381
chemisttree said:
I wonder what people would think of Palin if she said,

Now that would be priceless, yes?
Admittedly, that was a really bad mistake. Rather routine for Biden, he makes so many that as one article put it, "it's not even news". I think the difference is that when Biden makes a gaffe, he doesn't try to cover it up and try to make it sound like it's something it's not. It's the way Palin tries to backpeddle that smacks of dishonesty. If you say something stupid, and you admit it, people will forgive you. If you make a stupid mistake then try to make excuses for it, you're dishonest and lack integrity.
 
  • #382
Evo said:
Admittedly, that was a really bad mistake. Rather routine for Biden, he makes so many that as one article put it, "it's not even news". I think the difference is that when Biden makes a gaffe, he doesn't try to cover it up and try to make it sound like it's something it's not. It's the way Palin tries to backpeddle that smacks of dishonesty. If you say something stupid, and you admit it, people will forgive you. If you make a stupid mistake then try to make excuses for it, you're dishonest and lack integrity.

The McCain go to person on "what he meant to say" has been worked to a bare nub, this current campaign cycle.

How dare the Democrats pick on McCain's "verbiage", like can't politicians say whatever they want and not have to be accountable.
 
  • #383
It also has to do with their levels of experience, and how established they are in their positions. As a long-serving senator, Biden doesn't have to worry that any particular gaffe is going to make people question his qualifications. Palin, on the other hand, is a complete unknown, without any substantial record to lean on to illustrate her qualifications. She's been governor of Alaska for all of two years, which isn't even long enough for her to have run for re-election. One blown comment is not going to tank Biden's position, but it just might end Palin's career. Likewise, she can't afford to be pushed around, and so will doggedly resist any criticism on these points. Biden, again, has enough reserves of political capital that he can afford to admit when he's wrong.
 
  • #384
It's Reverend Muthee Time:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ccmRuCpFjY
 
  • #385
And heerrreees another article on Palin's veracity:

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/23140513/the_truth_about_sarah_palin
 
  • #386
Amp1 said:
And heerrreees another article on Palin's veracity:

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/23140513/the_truth_about_sarah_palin

Thanks for the link to Rolling Stone. Some of those aren't fully developed I think, though a number of the claims look accurate.

The one that I hadn't read before was the comment about the Meth labs there. 42 last year. 9 the year after Palin was Mayor. Now you can look at that a number of ways. That there is a great increase after her leaving. But that there were 9 labs during her reign. I tend to go with the 1 lab is too many school of thought.

I thought this story about Meth in Wasilla put a new light on the Small Town Family Values that Palin likes to claim she represents.

http://www.juneauempire.com/stories/030805/sta_20050308002.shtml
 
  • #387
You've got to love every time she talks.

Palin defends Alaska-Russia foreign policy remark

When Couric asked how Alaska's closeness to Russia enhanced her foreign policy experience, Palin said, "Well, it certainly does because our ... our next-door neighbors are foreign countries." Alaska shares a border with Canada.

Palin didn't answer directly when Couric inquired about whether she had been involved in any negotiations with the Russians.

"We have trade missions back and forth," she replied. As she continued, Palin brought up Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin.

"It's very important when you consider even national security issues with Russia as Putin rears his head and comes into the air space of the United States of America, where — where do they go? It's Alaska. It's just right over the border. It is — from Alaska that we send those out to make sure that an eye is being kept on this very powerful nation, Russia, because they are right there. They are right next to ... to our state," she said.
:rolleyes:

It seems I missed when Iraq and Afghanistan invaded US soil. But Palin won't let it happen again. :smile:

Palin was asked if she thought the U.S. presence in Iraq and Afghanistan was helping to mitigate terrorism

"I think our presence in Iraq and Afghanistan will lead to further security for our nation. We can never again let them onto our soil," she said.
Ok...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080925/ap_on_el_pr/palin;_ylt=Ap3xR4TEHXlDm044m9BcGGJh24cA
 
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  • #388
Evo said:
It seems I missed when Iraq and Afghanistan invaded US soil. But Palin won't let it happen again. :smile:

Ok...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080925/ap_on_el_pr/palin;_ylt=Ap3xR4TEHXlDm044m9BcGGJh24cA

The follow up then should have been whether that exclusion extends to taking them to Guantanamo and torturing them as the current administration does. Or would it rather be called "exorcisms" in any potential administration of hers. Have Reverend Muthee tie them up and drop them in water and if they sink they were telling the truth?
Rev_Muthee said:
... and ah ... rebuke the witchcraft.
 
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  • #389
I want to see a complete transcript, but if the above is actually what Palin said, she is accusing the governments of Iraq and Afghanistan of terrorism. Ooops.

Yes, I'm picking on her. :devil:
 
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  • #390
Evo said:
I want to see a complete transcript, but if the above is actually what Palin said, she is accusing the governments of Iraq and Afghanistan of terrorism. Ooops.

Yes, I'm picking on her. :devil:

Hey how about Reverend Muthee for Secretary of Education?

Then we can get God back in the schools.
 

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