Photoelectric effect without photons

[ShayanJ]

Recently I've seen claims here on PF(from some highly trusted members), that photoelectric effect can be described without using the photon concept and so can't be a demonstration of the quantized nature of light. This demonstration is only provided by more advanced experiments.
After that, I tried to find a paper that treats photoelectric effect using classical EM but I couldn't.
Can anyone point to such a paper?
Thanks

 

[ZapperZ]

Please read this JJ Thorn et al. paper and the references therein.

http://people.whitman.edu/~beckmk/QM/grangier/Thorn_ajp.pdf

You also have a misunderstanding here. The photoelectric effect experiment is the simplest and most naive demonstration of a more general photoemission phenomenon. The more advanced and more complex experiments such as multiphoton photoemission, angle-resolved photoemission, etc. all do NOT have a classical or semi classical description as of now.

Zz.

 

[ShayanJ]

You also have a misunderstanding here. The photoelectric effect experiment is the simplest and most naive demonstration of a more general photoemission phenomenon. The more advanced and more complex experiments such as multiphoton photoemission, angle-resolved photoemission, etc. all do NOT have a classical or semi classical description as of now.

So photoemission, in the general sense, has no classical or semi-classical description but one of its special cases, the "simplest and most naive" phenomenon considered by Einstein(which was what I meant when I said photoelectric effect because I don't know of a special name for that special case!), can be explained semi-classically i.e. with quantized matter and classical light. Right?

 

[dextercioby]

Yes, a semiclassical model - 'photoionization of a K shell electron': it's textbook material, see for example D. Blokhintsev's <Quantum Mechanics>, section 95, pp. 320 - 327 - Springer, 1964.

 

[ZapperZ]

Yes, a semiclassical model - 'photoionization of a K shell electron': it's textbook material, see for example D. Blokhintsev's <Quantum Mechanics>, section 95, pp. 320 - 327 - Springer, 1964.

Although, to be accurate, "photoionization" is not the same as "photoemission/photoelectric" effect. The latter is done on solids and involves electronic bands, rather than electron orbitals of isolated atoms/molecules of the former.

Zz.

 

[zoki85]

Can anyone point to such a paper?
Thanks

Not to a paper, but to interesting discussion I found on PFs:

https://www.physicsforums.com/threa...ight-not-explain-photoelectric-effect.144950/

 

[DrDu]

Yes, you can describe this as a scattering of electrons on the periodic classical field.