Physics PhD 5 years after ME undergrad

  • Thread starter Myers3x
  • Start date
  • Tags
    Physics phd
In summary, the military does not have a lot of openings for engineers, but there are a few positions that may be available for someone with a civil engineering degree and no research experience. He should consider looking into positions in research labs.
  • #1
Myers3x
4
2
Hi everyone,

Here is a little about my situation (from the United States). I want to apply to a physics PhD program in the future. I am currently serving in the military as an engineer with little over 2.5 years left before I plan to get out.

I have a mechanical engineering degree with a 3.5 GPA. Although I did do some projects and joined some clubs during my time at school, I have NO research experience. Being removed from college for so long, recommendation letters from academics is not a possibility. They will likely all be professional from people I have worked with. If needed, I will take the GRE to strengthen my application. From admissions websites it seems the GRE is not weighted as much as it used to be, if at all in some cases.

Is getting accepted into any decent program realistic to think about? I know my chances of getting into a top 20 university are slim to none, but I would like to get into a good school. Any advice on what I can do these next two and a half years to strengthen my application would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
 
Physics news on Phys.org
  • #2
There are practice physics GRE exams online. Try one, see how you do.
 
  • Like
Likes Myers3x, Vanadium 50 and berkeman
  • #3
Which branch? What's your designator?
 
  • #4
How much math and physics did you take as an undergrad?

Which field of physics do you want to do your PhD thesis in?
 
  • #5
Vanadium 50 said:
Which branch? What's your designator?
I’m in the Civil Engineer Corps.
 
  • #6
CrysPhys said:
How much math and physics did you take as an undergrad?

Which field of physics do you want to do your PhD thesis in?
General classes required for Eng. Calc 1-3, diff eq, then a couple general physics classes. Nothing above and beyond what was required for my degree. I understand I will have to take some “catch up” classes. I have a few fields I really enjoy, but I still have to do my research these next couple years to see what I really like the most.
 
  • #7
Let's start with the bad news.

You are not qualified, and unless you are a URM, the chances are excellent that you will need to pay yourself to, to use your words, "catch up". You're something like 6-9 classes behind where you need to be. In principle this can be done in a year, but it will be a tough year.

The GRE will not be optional for you. You need some piece of evidence that you are ready - and thus far, the evidence is that you are not - and can outcompete those with a traditional background.

Half of all PhDs come from ~15 schools (with some variation). "Not Top 20" closes maybe 60% of the doors, npy 6%.

Your letters are not FIREPs. They are supposed to be from people who can assess whether you will succeed in physics grad school, which means they should have gone their themselves. While physics research is not required for grad admissions, if your only letters in this category say "He did OK in my class" this is not helpful. So while research is not a requirement, it probably is for you.

This is probably not good news. You are likely in Guam or Gulfport if you aren't in some place ending in -stan. Research at a local college is unlikely (fun fact - Guam gets the fewest federal research dollars of any state or territory).

Now the good news. Ever wonder what happens to the CEC Flags when they retire? Some go to direct large research construction projects. A short, well-written letter to one, outlining your desire to get involved and what your constraints are might get some traction. The admiral won't be able to help you, of course, but he can drop a copy on a colleague's desk with a post-it note attached asking "can you help this person?"
 
  • Like
Likes Choppy and berkeman
  • #8
Why a PhD in Physics and not Engineering?
Have you looked at getting a position in one of the military labs? They frequently pay for people to get advanced degrees.
 
  • Like
Likes russ_watters and berkeman
  • #9
Frabjous said:
Have you looked at getting a position in one of the military labs?
1, He has 2-1/2 years on his contract, He tries to pick his next assignment, they are going to ask him to extend. They are not stupid.
2, Not all of these positions are even open to CEC officers.
3. He's not ready to be a scientist and too senior to be a hunchback.
 
  • Sad
Likes Frabjous
  • #10
There's something else to consider as well. If you didn't take senior physics courses as an undergrad and have no research experience, how do you know that a PhD in physics is the right path for you? That's not a question you have to answer here, but bear in mind there are a lot of physics undergrads who figure out that graduate school is not the path for them. And there are students who get into graduate school, but then as soon as the courses are over they dive deeply into research and find out that's not their passion. Hopefully that's not the case for you, but just be aware that the path you're considering may not be what you believe it is.
 
  • Like
Likes FactChecker, berkeman and Myers3x
  • #11
Choppy said:
Hopefully that's not the case for you, but just be aware that the path you're considering may not be what you believe it is.
Vanadium 50 said:
Let's start with the bad news.

You are not qualified, and unless you are a URM, the chances are excellent that you will need to pay yourself to, to use your words, "catch up". You're something like 6-9 classes behind where you need to be. In principle this can be done in a year, but it will be a tough year.
Thank you for these insights, I appreciate the straight answers. @Vanadium 50 , Kind of scary how accurately you were able to narrow down those locations, not giving any more information than that haha.

@Choppy is correct, I have no way of knowing this is what I actually want with no experience. Which leads me to this idea, if at all even possible. I use my GI bill to complete a physics undergrad without having to pay myself. With my eng classes it should not take more than 2-3 years. I can do research, strengthen my application, and really decide if this is what I want. Worst case, it's not, and I move on. Best case, what's an extra 2 years to do the career you want.
 
  • Like
Likes vela and gmax137
  • #12
Myers3x said:
I use my GI bill to complete a physics undergrad without having to pay myself.
This may or may not work.
  • A lot of places do not accept students for second BS degrees. The usual way around this is to pick up the classes as a non-degree seeking student.
  • Does the GI Bill cover work as a non-degree seeking student at a degree granting institution? This isn't barber school. I'd look very carefully at this before assuming it will work.
Your original undergraduate institution might prove more flexible.
 
  • Informative
Likes gmax137
  • #13
Myers3x said:
@Choppy is correct, I have no way of knowing this is what I actually want with no experience. Which leads me to this idea, if at all even possible. I use my GI bill to complete a physics undergrad without having to pay myself. With my eng classes it should not take more than 2-3 years. I can do research, strengthen my application, and really decide if this is what I want. Worst case, it's not, and I move on. Best case, what's an extra 2 years to do the career you want.

Myers3x said:
General classes required for Eng. Calc 1-3, diff eq, then a couple general physics classes. Nothing above and beyond what was required for my degree. I understand I will have to take some “catch up” classes. I have a few fields I really enjoy, but I still have to do my research these next couple years to see what I really like the most.
Let's set aside the issue of finances and GI bill coverage for now. The more fundamental question is, "What triggered your ambition to pursue a PhD in physics?" As an undergrad, you were not sitting on the fence, trying to decide between a major in physics and a major in ME. You took only the physics courses that were required for an ME major; nothing sparked your interest to take further physics electives.

So what in the interim has ignited your passion to pursue a PhD in physics? I can see if you were working as an ME and collaborating with physicists on a project, and you got interested in the physics side of the project. Then you would know what field of research you wish to pursue. But you don't.

And if you do decide to pursue a PhD in physics, your chances of success will depend on whether you pick a field in which you can leverage your ME background or whether you pick a field far, far astray from ME.
 
  • #14
@ V50 , kinda scared to respond and have you tell me my home address

@OP :
Certainly not an expert on this issue but I am a recently separated Naval Officer pursuing a MS in Applied Physics at night as I work as an engineer in NOVA by day. I was an EE undergrad and while on AD was an 1820, did some time afloat and had an assignment in NOVA that ignited my interest in Optics. Long term I want to pursue a PhD but this will probably be a slow burn for me (if it happens). I separated just short of 7 yrs and my academic muscles were weak, I've taken Math Methods (Riley, Hobson, Bence) , E&M (Jin, Jackson), and Optics (Hecht, Dereniak) thus far and it's been a fight. More to follow w/ Modern Physics and QM still to go (which my BS lacked). My firm "supports" my academic goals but I think trying to move to a Government Lab may be a better move for my goals. I hope to research optical frequency combs for spectrographs
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Likes Vanadium 50
  • #15
@diracs_stache -- Welcome to PF, and thank you for your service. :smile:

diracs_stache said:
and had an assignment in NOVA that ignited my interest in Optics.
I see what you did there... :wink:
 
  • #16
diracs_stache said:
kinda scared to respond and have you tell me my home address
Naw...don't worry about that. But your lawn is getting a little...oh, nevermind.

How fast do you think you are going relative to a full-time student? Half? One-third? Something else? That would help calibrate people's expectations.
 
  • #17
Vanadium 50 said:
Naw...don't worry about that. But your lawn is getting a little...oh, nevermind.

How fast do you think you are going relative to a full-time student? Half? One-third? Something else? That would help calibrate people's expectations.
Okay thats scary lol

I'd say at a glacial pace, but quantitatively probably 35-40%. Most instances of full time MS students I can reference were 15-21 mos and 39-45 mos is what is my aim for coursework + thesis.
 
  • #18
It's really not anything special. Finding Seabees in Gulfport or Guam is like finding SWOs in Norfolk. Or an LCS driver in the unemployment line (sorry...that was just plain mean),

I know a few 1810s, but no 1820's. I presume that your community has the same problem most RL communities do: they have a huge need for junior officers, but not many billets for O-4s and up. Junior officers see the writing on the wall, and decide to serve elsewhere. This is why I cringe when I read the advice "the service will pay for you to get a PhD!", because usually the services aren't so interested in this.

Your 35-40% matches my factor of 2-3. Given that the average physics PhD takes 7 years, that means a reasonable expectation is 15-20 years, and for most people, most professors, and most universities, this is just not realistic.

Unfortunately, lack of realism is a problem. Many people think they can, even part-time, move substantially faster than people can.
 

FAQ: Physics PhD 5 years after ME undergrad

1. Is it feasible to pursue a Physics PhD 5 years after completing a Mechanical Engineering (ME) undergraduate degree?

Yes, it is feasible to pursue a Physics PhD 5 years after completing a Mechanical Engineering undergraduate degree. Many graduate programs value diverse academic backgrounds and professional experiences, which can provide a unique perspective and skill set. However, you may need to take some prerequisite courses to bridge any gaps in your physics knowledge.

2. What challenges might I face when transitioning from a Mechanical Engineering background to a Physics PhD program?

One of the main challenges is the difference in foundational knowledge. While Mechanical Engineering and Physics share some common ground, physics PhD programs often require a deep understanding of advanced theoretical concepts that may not have been covered extensively in an ME program. You may need to spend extra time on coursework and self-study to catch up. Additionally, adapting to the research methodologies and expectations in physics can also be a challenge.

3. Will my Mechanical Engineering background be beneficial in a Physics PhD program?

Absolutely, your Mechanical Engineering background can be highly beneficial. The problem-solving skills, mathematical proficiency, and practical experience gained during your ME studies can provide a strong foundation for tackling complex problems in physics. Moreover, interdisciplinary research areas such as applied physics, materials science, and engineering physics can greatly benefit from your engineering expertise.

4. How can I prepare for a Physics PhD program after working in the engineering field for 5 years?

To prepare for a Physics PhD program, you should review and strengthen your understanding of fundamental physics concepts. Taking additional courses in advanced physics topics, either online or at a local university, can be very helpful. Engaging in self-study through textbooks and research papers, as well as gaining some research experience in physics, possibly through collaborations or part-time research positions, can also prepare you for the transition.

5. What are the career prospects after completing a Physics PhD with a Mechanical Engineering background?

Career prospects are quite diverse and promising. With a Physics PhD and an ME background, you can pursue academic positions, research roles in national laboratories, and opportunities in the private sector, particularly in industries such as aerospace, automotive, energy, and technology. Your interdisciplinary skills will be highly valued in roles that require both engineering and advanced physics knowledge.

Similar threads

Replies
3
Views
545
Replies
50
Views
6K
Replies
11
Views
2K
Replies
4
Views
3K
Replies
4
Views
1K
Replies
21
Views
3K
Replies
4
Views
2K
Back
Top