Proving Non-Convergence of an Improper Integral

Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around proving the non-convergence of the improper integral \(\int_0^{\infty} \sin^2(\pi(x + 1/x))dx\). Participants explore the nature of the integrand and its behavior as \(x\) approaches infinity.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the periodicity of the integrand, with some questioning the validity of the original proof's reasoning. There are attempts to change variables, specifically using \(u = x + 1/x\), and to analyze the implications of this substitution on the integral's convergence.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with various interpretations being explored. Some participants have suggested alternative approaches and questioned assumptions made in the original proof. There is a recognition of the complexity involved in rigorously proving divergence, particularly in relation to the behavior of the integrand and the substitution used.

Contextual Notes

Participants note challenges related to integrating the function and the need for complex numbers, which some have not yet learned. There is also mention of the integrand being positive and "wavy," contributing to the belief that the area under the curve diverges.

JG89
Messages
724
Reaction score
1

Homework Statement



Prove that [tex]\int_0^{\infty} sin^2(\pi(x + 1/x))dx[/tex] does not exist.

Homework Equations


The Attempt at a Solution

First, we can construct a sequence as follows:

[tex]\int_0^{\infty} f(x)dx = \lim_{n \rightarrow \infty} S_n[/tex], where [tex]S_n =\int_0^{1} f(x)dx, \int_0^{2} f(x)dx, \int_0^{3} f(x)dx, \int_0^{4} f(x)dx, ..., \int_0^{n} f(x)dx[/tex]. Now, the sequence S_n converges as n approaches infinity if and only if [tex]|S_m - S_n| < \epsilon[/tex] for all epsilon > 0, provided that there is an integer N such that m,n > N. We set m = n + 1. We then have [tex]|S_{n+1} - S_n| = | \int_0^{n+1} f(x)dx - \int_0^{n} f(x)dx |[/tex].

Now,

[tex]\int_0^{n+1} f(x)dx - \int_0^{n} f(x)dx = \int_n^{n+1} f(x)dx = f(c)[/tex] for some c inbetween n and n + 1 (By the MVT of Integral Calculus). And so [tex]|S_{n+1} - S_n}| = f(c)[/tex]. Now, if |f(c)| < epsilon for sufficiently large c (remember that c goes to infinity as n goes to infinity), then this means that the function approaches a limit of 0, which it obviously doesn't as it's periodic. Thus the integral doesn't converge. QED.How does this proof look?
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
Nah, I don't buy that. The integrand isn't really periodic in the variable x, is it? It is periodic in the variable u=x+1/x and it's bounded in x. Try to exploit that.
 
You don't think the entire proof works, or just the last part where I say the function is periodic? I'll get cracking back on this problem tomorrow, I've got to catch some sleep now. Goodnight.
 
Last edited:
The whole proof. How do you know |f(c)|<epsilon is impossible? Even if it was periodic. It's a pile of junk. Throw it away. Think about the change of variable u=x+1/x for x larger than some number. Now it's periodic and positive in that range. Obviously divergent. But don't forget about accounting for du vs. dx.
 
JG89 said:
You don't think the entire proof works, or just the last part where I say the function is periodic? I'll get cracking back on this problem tomorrow, I've got to catch some sleep now. Goodnight.

Goodnight. Think about it fresh in the morning.
 
Sorry about the late reply, I've been tied up lately.

So I've tried using u = x + 1/x. Then du = (1 - 1/x^2)dx and so this is difficult to integrate...infact according to my integrator, it needs to use complex numbers and since I haven't learned that yet, I know that I'm not really looking to integrate the function...


Looking at the graph of the function, it seems that since it's continuously "wavy" and positive over all of R, then the area under the graph from 0 to infinity must be infinity, and so it diverges. I'm just having trouble proving this rigorously.
 
JG89 said:
Sorry about the late reply, I've been tied up lately.

So I've tried using u = x + 1/x. Then du = (1 - 1/x^2)dx and so this is difficult to integrate...infact according to my integrator, it needs to use complex numbers and since I haven't learned that yet, I know that I'm not really looking to integrate the function...


Looking at the graph of the function, it seems that since it's continuously "wavy" and positive over all of R, then the area under the graph from 0 to infinity must be infinity, and so it diverges. I'm just having trouble proving this rigorously.

Right. But the point is that for large values of x, du is ALMOST dx. If x>2 then (1-1/x^2)>=3/4. Isn't that enough to prove it diverges?
 
Hmmm...I'm not sure I'm entirely getting what you're saying, but I'll give it a shot:

For x getting larger and larger, du gets closer and closer to dx. I see that (1 - 1/x^2) increases monotonically towards 1 as x tends to infinity, so we could say that for very large values of x, du = dx + r(x), where r(x) is some function approximating the error. Since du gets closer and closer to dx, we know that r(x) goes to 0 as x approaches infinity. So using the substitution u = 1 + 1/x we have

[tex]\int_0^{\infty} sin^2(\pi(x + 1/x))dx = \lim_{\beta \rightarrow \infty} \int_0^{\beta} sin^2(\pi(u))(du - r(x))[/tex].

Since as beta tends to infinity r(x) must go to 0 and we will have du = dx, we have [tex]\lim_{\beta \rightarrow \infty} \int_0^{\beta} sin^2(\pi(u))(du - r(x)) = \int_0^{\infty} sin^2(\pi(u))du[/tex] which obviously diverges since the integrand is positive and periodic.
 
You have the right idea. But the expression is pretty awkward. Why not just say that for x>2 and u=x+1/x that the integral of sin^2(pi*(x+1/x))dx=sin^2(pi*u)(1-1/x^2)dx>the integral of sin^2(pi*u)*(4/3)*du. Since the latter diverges, the former must diverge.
 
  • #10
There we go...thanks for all the help!

Besides practice, practice, and some more practice, do you have any tips on how to recognize how one should start the proof?
 
  • #11
Feelings from the gut. I think you had that to begin with. You KNEW it diverged, right? See the big picture. Like, this is 'almost' this. Now learn to put 'almost' into words. That's how I do it.
 
Last edited:

Similar threads

Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 105 ·
4
Replies
105
Views
11K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
Replies
20
Views
2K
Replies
12
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K