Question About The Stars -- Can they have died before we see their light?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of whether the light we observe from stars could be from stars that have already died, particularly focusing on the implications of light travel time and the life cycles of stars. Participants explore both theoretical and observational aspects of this topic.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that the light we see from stars could indeed be from stars that have died, as it takes time for light to reach Earth.
  • Others argue that most visible stars are still alive and in stable phases of their life cycles, with Betelgeuse being a notable exception that may not have died yet.
  • A participant explains that when a star like Betelgeuse goes supernova, we would receive neutrinos from the event before the light, due to the different ways these particles travel through space.
  • One contributor mentions that we can observe "dead" stars using telescopes like the Hubble Space Telescope, noting that many stars in distant galaxies have long since exhausted their fuel and are no longer emitting light.
  • Another participant suggests that Eta Carinae, which has been visible historically, may have already gone supernova, indicating that some stars we see might not be in their original state.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a mix of agreement and disagreement. While some agree that light from distant stars may come from stars that have died, others maintain that most visible stars are still alive. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the status of specific stars like Betelgeuse and Eta Carinae.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the complexities of light travel time and the life cycles of stars, with some participants relying on observational data and others on theoretical considerations. There are unresolved assumptions about the life expectancy of various stars and the implications of redshift in cosmological observations.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to amateur astronomers, astrophysics students, and anyone curious about stellar evolution and observational astronomy.

TheQuestionGuy14
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Stars have always interested me, I view them every night with my telescope. One thing really interested me though, if star's light can take thousands of years to reach our planet. I was wondering, does this mean that the light we see could be the light of a star that has died, maybe for hundreds of years?
 
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Yes and we would find out when the light reaches us.
 
Yes, however, every star you can see now is still there. Space is so huge that almost every visible star is actually fairly close to us, and we can determine where they are in their life cycles. Most are middle aged and we know that they'll continue to live for billions of years. As far as I know, the only star that you can see with the naked eye that might not be there anymore is Betelgeuse, and that's still very unlikely. Most estimates give it at least another hundred thousand years or so to live and it's only 700 light years away.

We'll actually know it's exploded a couple of hours before we actually see the light from the explosion. When the core collapses, it creates a blast of neutrinos and gamma radiation. The gamma radiation heats up the outer layers of the star and causes the explosion, but it takes time for that energy to trudge through the millions of miles of dense plasma to escape. The neutrinos, on the other hand, went straight through the plasma like it wasn't even there and gets a head start on the faster photons, so they make it here first.
 
newjerseyrunner said:
Yes, however, every star you can see now is still there.

Remember that the OP has a telescope. :wink:

newjerseyrunner said:
As far as I know, the only star that you can see with the naked eye that might not be there anymore is Betelgeuse, and that's still very unlikely. Most estimates give it at least another hundred thousand years or so to live and it's only 700 light years away.

Indeed. I can't decide if I want to see Betelgeuse go supernova in my lifetime or not. It would be an absolutely stunning sight, but at the same time I really like the Orion constellation. :cry:
 
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We see dead stars on a regular basis with large telescopes like the HST. The Hubble deep field image [HDF] includes numerous galaxies out to a redshift of z=6 or more. Galaxies at redshift z=6 are believed to be sources of photons that were emitted around 12 billion years ago, much older than the life expectancy of an average size star like the sun. Such stars would have long ago used up their original fuel reserves and are now faint corpses. Of course bright stars, the easiest ones to detect at great distances, are more massive and have much shorter life spans than the sun, so they too are long gone. In short, most of the stars comprising galaxies in the Hubble deep field are no longer emitting detectable photons. If we could see them as they are today, the HDF galaxies would look significantly different than at present. Cosmologists use images of galaxies at different redshifts to formulate models of how stars and galaxies have evolved over the history of the universe.
 
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Eta Carinae has been visible to the naked eye in historical times and it is not unreasonable to think it has already gone supernova.
 
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