Resistor value for Enable/Disable

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around determining the appropriate resistor value for the Enable/Disable pin of integrated circuits (ICs). Participants explore the calculation methods for resistor values, the implications of using pullup or pulldown resistors, and considerations for testability in manufacturing processes.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that the resistor value can be calculated based on the output current of the input and the input logic high/low threshold voltage values, emphasizing the need for the resistor value to ensure the input logic voltage level is met.
  • One participant mentions using a 10K resistor but expresses uncertainty about how to calculate the appropriate value.
  • Another participant proposes that a lower resistor value should be chosen to provide a margin above the calculated upper bound for the resistor value.
  • There is a discussion about the role of resistors in testability during the In-Circuit-Test (ICT) stage, with some participants questioning how a resistor aids in testing when a test point could exist without one.
  • Examples are provided for calculating resistor values using specific ICs, such as the 74LS00 quad NAND gate and the 75175 line driver, with calculations based on their respective input voltage and current specifications.
  • Participants inquire whether the same principles apply to Enable/Disable pins as to unused pins, suggesting that the characteristics should be similar but recommending verification against datasheets.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the need to calculate resistor values based on specific parameters, but there is no consensus on the best practices for Enable/Disable pins versus unused pins, and the discussion remains unresolved regarding the optimal resistor values for these specific applications.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include potential dependencies on specific IC datasheets and the need for further clarification on the characteristics of Enable/Disable pins compared to unused pins.

likephysics
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How is the resistor value for an IC Enable/disable pin decided.
I always use 10K. But not sure how to calculate it .
Do you connect Enable bar directly to ground or thru a resistor.
 
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likephysics said:
How is the resistor value for an IC Enable/disable pin decided.
I always use 10K. But not sure how to calculate it .
Do you connect Enable bar directly to ground or thru a resistor.

You can calculate the range of allowable pullup/pulldown resistor values based on the output current of the input (bias current) and the input logic high/low threshold voltage values. So the resistor value must be low enough so that the input logic voltage level is met, while the input bias current is passing through the resistor. That gives you an upper bound on the reisistor value, and you'll choose something to give you 2x or 4x margin or so.

The reason to use a resistor to tie off an input (that is always at high or low) is for testability at the In-Circuit-Test (ICT) stage in manufacturing. That's the "bed of nails" test that checks continuity and basic component values on your PCB assembly.
 
berkeman said:
You can calculate the range of allowable pullup/pulldown resistor values based on the output current of the input (bias current) and the input logic high/low threshold voltage values. So the resistor value must be low enough so that the input logic voltage level is met, while the input bias current is passing through the resistor. That gives you an upper bound on the reisistor value, and you'll choose something to give you 2x or 4x margin or so.

I'm a bit confused. An example would help.

The reason to use a resistor to tie off an input (that is always at high or low) is for testability at the In-Circuit-Test (ICT) stage in manufacturing. That's the "bed of nails" test that checks continuity and basic component values on your PCB assembly.

How would the resistor help for ICT?
They can have a test point without resistor.
 
likephysics said:
I'm a bit confused. An example would help.



How would the resistor help for ICT?
They can have a test point without resistor.

I'll try to post an example later today if I can get back to the PF. For ICT, if an input is hard grounded, you cannot tell if the IC pin is connected or not. All the ICT test point on that net can detect is the hard ground. If you connect the input to ground with a pulldown resistor, you can measure the value of the resistor, and also detect that the IC pin is connected (because of the internal ESD protection diodes to Vcc and Ground).
 
Sorry for the delay -- crazy busy weekend.

So for a simple example, say you want to use a pulldown resistor to tie off an unused input to a 74LS00 quad NAND gate. From the old TI TTL databook (yes, the yellow one), you get:

Vil = 0.8V max

Iil = -0.4mA max at Vil = 0.4V

So for the second set of numbers, you could use a resistor R = 0.4V / 0.4mA = 1k Ohm, but it would be best to use a smaller resistor by 2x or so to have margin on Vil.

For a more modern example, we can check the 75175 line driver that you mentioned in your PM to me.

http://pdf1.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/view/5748/MOTOROLA/SN75175D.html

Vil = 0.8V max

Iil = -100uA at Vil = 0.4V

So the second set of numbers gives you R = 4k Ohms.
 
berkeman said:
Sorry for the delay -- crazy busy weekend.

So for a simple example, say you want to use a pulldown resistor to tie off an unused input to a 74LS00 quad NAND gate. From the old TI TTL databook (yes, the yellow one), you get:

Vil = 0.8V max

Iil = -0.4mA max at Vil = 0.4V

So for the second set of numbers, you could use a resistor R = 0.4V / 0.4mA = 1k Ohm, but it would be best to use a smaller resistor by 2x or so to have margin on Vil.

For a more modern example, we can check the 75175 line driver that you mentioned in your PM to me.

http://pdf1.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/view/5748/MOTOROLA/SN75175D.html

Vil = 0.8V max

Iil = -100uA at Vil = 0.4V

So the second set of numbers gives you R = 4k Ohms.
Thanks. This is for unused pins only, correct?
What about resistor values for Enable/disable?
 
likephysics said:
Thanks. This is for unused pins only, correct?
What about resistor values for Enable/disable?

The Enable input should have the same characteristics as the general inputs, I would think. Just double-check the datasheets to be sure.
 

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