Room heat loss to open door? - Program Idea

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the calculation of heat loss from a room when an outside door or window is open. Participants explore various factors influencing heat transfer, including ambient air temperature, wind speed, and airflow dynamics. The conversation includes theoretical considerations and potential programming approaches for a calculator project.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant is developing a C++ program to calculate heat loss and seeks a formula to relate ambient air temperature to outside air temperature through an open door, considering wind effects.
  • Another participant suggests that air movement through an open door can be explained by turbulence and convection, raising questions about the complexity of calculating heat loss from first principles.
  • A third participant references a document on airflow through large openings, mentioning studies that have improved models of ventilation and heat loss rates, particularly in relation to wind effects.
  • Another contribution emphasizes that heat loss involves conduction, convection, and radiation, noting the complexity of the situation with an open door and the availability of formulas for closed rooms.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying views on the feasibility of calculating heat loss from first principles, with some suggesting reliance on empirical data while others acknowledge the complexity of the problem. No consensus is reached on a specific formula or approach.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the limitations of existing formulas for closed rooms and the need for empirical data on airflow rates through open doors. The discussion reflects uncertainty regarding the impact of various factors on heat loss calculations.

Who May Find This Useful

Individuals interested in programming, thermodynamics, HVAC systems, and energy efficiency may find this discussion relevant.

mkjt88
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Hello all. I've been teaching myself C++ programming and had an idea for a project. I am building a calculator for the heat loss of a room when an outside door/window is open. I'm currently writing out the functions I need to make this happen... Now what I need help with is this. I can't seem to stumble upon a formula I can use to test ambient air to outside air temps through the means of wind or just exposing the two through the door. I guess it's not the best explanation but do you get what I mean?? I plan to add in three variables if necessary to match if higher wind speeds were forcing more cold air in. Anyway any help on how to solve this would be much appreciated.
 
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That's a tricky problem. Consider.. How does any air get in if there is no way for the air to get out? I can think of two mechanisims...

1) Turbulence - allowing air to enter one part of the door opening and exit via another.
2) Convection - cold air enters at the bottom and warm air leaves at the top.

I can see a host of factors altering the amount of ventilation an open door provides. I doubt it's going to be possible to calculate all this from first principles. Probably best see if you can google up data on energy lost from real world trials. Perhaps it's been done for retail stores that have open doors?

If you can find data on typical air flow rates through an open door its possible to caculate the implied heat loss..

The power lost to ventilation is given by:

Power = Temperature delta * Volumetric heat capacity of air * flow rate

If air conditioning is involved it's probably more complicated due to the water content to the air.
 
I haven't read it but a quick scan might give you an idea of the complexity...

http://www.ecbcs.org/docs/annex_20_air_flow_through_large.pdf

Selected quotes..

Airflow Through Large Openings on Buildings

New studies of interzonal airflow and single sided ventilation at seven laboratories in Europe and Canada, have then been canied out in this project's framework and have led to improved models.

The single sided ventilation studies (chapter 4) were designed to determine the effect of wind on the ventilation and/or heat loss rates through openings in one external wall only. Collaboration between four european laboratories led to the following conuibutions :

- CSTB test house at Bouin, France, with horizontal slit, to measure internal pressures and the effect of air compressibility
- BBRI attic test room at Gent, Belgium, with open window, to monitor long term ventilation rates and assess possible correlations with measured parameters including wind, temperature and surface pressures
- BRE office at Garston, England, with open window, to assess the time dependence of
ventilation rates following the opening of the window, due to the combined effect of the wind and the thermal properties of the room.
- EPFL offices at Lausanne, Switzerland, with open window, to study the energy consequences of user behaviour by measuring the time dependence of cooling induced by natural ventilation for rooms of different thermal mass.
 
Heat loss is a factor of conduction, convection, radiation. As noted already, with an open door it is VERY complicated.

You can find formulas for calculating heat losses in a closed room...In those, an air exchange flow with the outside, as through window and door frames is assumed.
And they have formulas for various temperature differences and outside wind speed.
 

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