Simulating opposing rotational forces at different points on structure

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around simulating opposing rotational forces on a structure, specifically focusing on the tangential force acting on a point and the corresponding opposing force due to the moment of inertia of a mass located at a different position. Participants explore the implications of modeling flexible structures and the accuracy of simulation methods.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Ash seeks to determine the proper magnitude of the opposing force caused by the moment of inertia in a simulation of a rotating structure.
  • Some participants question the validity of the diagram presented by Ash, suggesting that the representation of forces may not conform to established physics.
  • Ash clarifies that the arrow representing the force from the mass is intended to denote a reaction force that must be included in the simulation.
  • Concerns are raised about the simulation's adherence to known physics, particularly regarding the necessity of a reaction force at the mass without an applied force.
  • Ash explains that the simulation's limitations require modeling the effect of mass as a negative force related to the input force.
  • One participant argues that the simulation approach may yield erroneous results and suggests calculating inertia effects manually instead of relying on the simulation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the validity of the simulation approach and the representation of forces. There is no consensus on the correctness of Ash's method or the implications of the simulation's limitations.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight potential limitations in the simulation's design and its deviation from conventional physics principles, particularly concerning the representation of forces and the treatment of inertia.

AshSechler
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Hi,

I am trying to simulate a tangential force acting on a point on a structure and the corresponding opposing force caused by the moment of inertia of a mass at a different position.



In this image the structure rotates around point c and there is a vector out of mass m opposing the rotation caused by tangential force F.

My main question: What would the proper magnitude of the opposing force caused by the moment of inertia be?

If it is much easier to pretend that the structure is rigid, what kind of equation would I use? I have been able to find the angular acceleration based on the total torque and total moment of inertia. Is mass x radius x acceleration the right idea?

thanks!

Ash
 
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Welcome to PF;
Your diagram is incorrect - remove the arrow from the mass (unless you are also applying a force there.)
Model flexible rods/structures as a mass and spring system, then you can draw free-body diagrams as usual.
 
Hey Simon,

thanks for your response. I should be more clear - the arrow out of the mass represents the reaction force, which i do need to manually add in this simulation.
 
can anybody help me?
 
You have received help.

- why would there be a reaction force at the mass like that?
- if it is mandated by your simulation, then your simulation does not appear to conform to known physics. The way you get such a force is if there is some sort of drag or friction there. Is this a program you have developed yourself or one you have been given or purchased?
 
because of the limitations of the simulator, I must describe the effect of the mass(slowing the rate of acceleration) as a negative force as a function of the input force.
 
Then your simulation does not conform to known physics and will give erroneous results.
You would basically have to calculate the effect of the inertia by hand, then work out what sort of "simulated force" would be needed to get the simulator to do the same thing - why not just write an animation and cut out the middle-man?

This is not physics.
I cannot help you.
 

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