Solve for positive integer solutions

  • Context: MHB 
  • Thread starter Thread starter anemone
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Integer Positive
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around finding positive integer solutions for the equation \(x^2 + x = y^3 + y^2 + y\). The scope includes mathematical reasoning and exploration of potential solutions.

Discussion Character

  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants restate the problem of finding positive integers \(x\) and \(y\) that satisfy the equation.
  • One participant presents a detailed solution involving factorization and the properties of coprime integers, leading to a contradiction that suggests no positive integer solutions exist.
  • A later reply reiterates the same reasoning and conclusions as the previous participant, emphasizing the contradiction found in the argument.
  • Another participant expresses appreciation for the solution provided, indicating engagement with the mathematical reasoning presented.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the reasoning leading to the conclusion that no positive integer solutions exist, although the initial problem is restated multiple times without additional new insights.

Contextual Notes

The discussion does not explore alternative methods or solutions beyond the presented reasoning, and it remains focused on the implications of the derived contradictions.

anemone
Gold Member
MHB
POTW Director
Messages
3,851
Reaction score
115
Solve for positive integers $x$ and $y$ where $x^2+x=y^3+y^2+y$.
 
Mathematics news on Phys.org
anemone said:
Solve for positive integers $x$ and $y$ where $x^2+x=y^3+y^2+y$.

Trick question?

Pretty sure there's no solution to that.

2x = -1 + SQRT[1 + 4y(y^2 + y + 1)]

Tu est cruel, Anemone!
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Wilmer said:
Trick question?

Pretty sure there's no solution to that.

2x = -1 + SQRT[1 + 4y(y^2 + y + 1)]

Tu est cruel, Anemone!
No, that is a genuine contest problem and solver is expected to convince us why the above equation has no solutions. (Malthe)

Au fait, Je suis tout mignon et gentil.:p
 
anemone said:
No, that is a genuine contest problem and solver is expected to convince us why the above equation has no solutions. (Malthe)

Au fait, Je suis tout mignon et gentil.:p

needs closure
 
anemone said:
Solve for positive integers $x$ and $y$ where $x^2+x=y^3+y^2+y$.

My solution:
Note that $x^2+x=x(x+1)$ is the product of two consecutive positive integers whereas $y^3+y^2+y=y(y^2+y+1)$ can never represent the product of two consecutive positive integers. So we can conclude the problem has no solution.
 
anemone said:
My solution:
Note that $x^2+x=x(x+1)$ is the product of two consecutive positive integers whereas $y^3+y^2+y=y(y^2+y+1)$ can never represent the product of two consecutive positive integers. So we can conclude the problem has no solution.
I'm not saying you are wrong, anemone, but your argument doesn't hold for something like the case 8 * 9 = 4 * 18. No one says that the x function and y function have to give the same pair of factors.
-Dan
 
anemone said:
Solve for positive integers $x$ and $y$ where $x^2+x=y^3+y^2+y$.
[sp]Write the equation as $x^2 - y^2 + x - y = y^3.$ The left side factorises, giving $(x-y)(x+y + 1) = y^3.$ Suppose that $p$ is a prime common divisor of $x-y$ and $x+y+1$. Then $p$ also divides their product $y^3$ and therefore $p$ divides $y$. So $p$ divides $(x-y)+2y = x+y$. It follows that $p$ cannot divide $x+y+1$, contradicting the initial assumption about $p$.

That contradiction shows that no such $p$ can exist, and therefore $x-y$ and $x+y+1$ are coprime. But their product is a cube, and so they must each individually be cubes, say $x-y = u^3$ and $x+y+1 = v^3$, where $u,v$ are integers with $v>u>0.$ Also, $u^3v^3 = y^3$ so that $y=uv.$

Thus $x-uv = u^3$ and $x + uv + 1 = v^3$. Hence $(u^3 + uv) + uv + 1 = v^3$, from which $$2uv+1 = v^3 - u^3 = (v-u)(v^2 + uv + u^2).$$ But $v-u \geqslant 1$ and hence $v^2 + uv + u^2 \leqslant 2uv+1.$ Therefore $$0 < (v-u)^2 = v^2 - 2uv + u^2 = (v^2 + uv + u^2) - 3uv \leqslant (2uv+1) - 3uv = 1 - uv <0.$$ That is another contradiction, and the conclusion this time is that no positive integer solution $(x,y)$ to the original equation can exist.[/sp]
 
Opalg said:
[sp]Write the equation as $x^2 - y^2 + x - y = y^3.$ The left side factorises, giving $(x-y)(x+y + 1) = y^3.$ Suppose that $p$ is a prime common divisor of $x-y$ and $x+y+1$. Then $p$ also divides their product $y^3$ and therefore $p$ divides $y$. So $p$ divides $(x-y)+2y = x+y$. It follows that $p$ cannot divide $x+y+1$, contradicting the initial assumption about $p$.

That contradiction shows that no such $p$ can exist, and therefore $x-y$ and $x+y+1$ are coprime. But their product is a cube, and so they must each individually be cubes, say $x-y = u^3$ and $x+y+1 = v^3$, where $u,v$ are integers with $v>u>0.$ Also, $u^3v^3 = y^3$ so that $y=uv.$

Thus $x-uv = u^3$ and $x + uv + 1 = v^3$. Hence $(u^3 + uv) + uv + 1 = v^3$, from which $$2uv+1 = v^3 - u^3 = (v-u)(v^2 + uv + u^2).$$ But $v-u \geqslant 1$ and hence $v^2 + uv + u^2 \leqslant 2uv+1.$ Therefore $$0 < (v-u)^2 = v^2 - 2uv + u^2 = (v^2 + uv + u^2) - 3uv \leqslant (2uv+1) - 3uv = 1 - uv <0.$$ That is another contradiction, and the conclusion this time is that no positive integer solution $(x,y)$ to the original equation can exist.[/sp]

Thanks Opalg for participating and thanks for the smart solution!(Cool)
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
1K
Replies
1
Views
2K
Replies
1
Views
1K