Solve Txy Diagram Problem: Methanol & Water @ 25°C

  • Thread starter Thread starter runningman19
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Diagram
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a homework problem involving the application of Raoult's law and the use of a Txy diagram to determine the composition of a methanol-water system at elevated temperatures. Participants explore the relationship between liquid and vapor phases, mole fractions, and the implications of heating the solution.

Discussion Character

  • Homework-related
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Nick expresses difficulty with Raoult's law and the associated calculations for a system containing methanol and water, questioning how to determine the remaining liquid phase composition after heating.
  • Nick attempts to apply Raoult's law but finds the equations unsolvable due to too many unknowns.
  • Another participant suggests that the problem is more about using the Txy diagram rather than solely applying Raoult's law, prompting a series of questions about mole fractions and phase behavior at different temperatures.
  • A later reply proposes a method to find the mole fraction of methanol in the liquid phase by using the Txy diagram, indicating that at a certain temperature, the mole fraction of methanol in the liquid phase would be around 0.1.
  • Another participant corrects the previous claim, emphasizing the need to apply the "lever rule" to determine the total number of moles of liquid remaining and clarifying that the mole fraction of methanol is 0.1, not 0.1 mole percent.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the best approach to solve the problem, with some focusing on Raoult's law while others emphasize the importance of the Txy diagram. There is also a correction regarding the interpretation of mole fractions, indicating some disagreement on the details of the calculations.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the complexity of the problem, including the need to account for multiple unknowns and the specific conditions under which the Txy diagram is used. The discussion highlights the importance of understanding the definitions and relationships between liquid and vapor phases.

runningman19
Messages
19
Reaction score
3

Homework Statement


Hi Everyone,
I am having trouble grasping the concept of Raoult's law, partial pressures etc. One problem in specific is: A system contains 3 moles of methanol and 7 moles of water at 25 degrees celsius. The temperature is raised until there is 40 mol% methanol in the gas phase. How much is left in the liquid phase?
The Txy diagram is attached.
Thanks so much guys,
Nick

2. Homework Equations [/B]
Raoult's Law: yaPa=xaP*a
Txy diagram attached

The Attempt at a Solution


I believe this problem requires the use of Raoult's law in some form. I have written separate Raoult's law equations for water and methanol in the solution, but neither of these equations is solvable because there are too many unknowns and too few equations.
media%2Fedc%2Fedc43b8e-065e-4e3a-9386-85eff60f645a%2FphpxtBYmN.png
 
Physics news on Phys.org
runningman19 said:

Homework Statement


Hi Everyone,
I am having trouble grasping the concept of Raoult's law, partial pressures etc. One problem in specific is: A system contains 3 moles of methanol and 7 moles of water at 25 degrees celsius. The temperature is raised until there is 40 mol% methanol in the gas phase. How much is left in the liquid phase?
The Txy diagram is attached.
Thanks so much guys,
Nick

2. Homework Equations [/B]
Raoult's Law: yaPa=xaP*a
Txy diagram attached

The Attempt at a Solution


I believe this problem requires the use of Raoult's law in some form. I have written separate Raoult's law equations for water and methanol in the solution, but neither of these equations is solvable because there are too many unknowns and too few equations.
media%2Fedc%2Fedc43b8e-065e-4e3a-9386-85eff60f645a%2FphpxtBYmN.png
This is a problem in learning how to use a Txy diagram (not Raoult's law). x is the mole fraction of methanol in the liquid phase and y is the mole fraction methanol in the gas phase. What is the initial mole fraction of methanol in the liquid phase at 25 C? As you heat the solution up (holding the total pressure on the solution constant at 1 atm), at what temperature do you begin to form a vapor phase? What is the mole fraction of methanol in the initial vapor that is formed? At what temperature will there be a mole fraction of 0.4 methanol in the vapor phase? What will be the mole fraction of methanol in the liquid phase at that temperature? At this point, how many total moles of liquid will you have and how many total moles of vapor will you have? How many moles of methanol will remain in the liquid phase?
 
Chestermiller said:
This is a problem in learning how to use a Txy diagram (not Raoult's law). x is the mole fraction of methanol in the liquid phase and y is the mole fraction methanol in the gas phase. What is the initial mole fraction of methanol in the liquid phase at 25 C? As you heat the solution up (holding the total pressure on the solution constant at 1 atm), at what temperature do you begin to form a vapor phase? What is the mole fraction of methanol in the initial vapor that is formed? At what temperature will there be a mole fraction of 0.4 methanol in the vapor phase? What will be the mole fraction of methanol in the liquid phase at that temperature? At this point, how many total moles of liquid will you have and how many total moles of vapor will you have? How many moles of methanol will remain in the liquid phase?
I think I got it. If you find 0.3 mol% on the x-axis and move up until you hit 0.4 mol% methanol on the vapor curve, you would end up with around 0.1 mol% methanol in the liquid phase. That means at that temperature 0.1 mol% methanol would exist as a liquid.
Thanks
 
runningman19 said:
I think I got it. If you find 0.3 mol% on the x-axis and move up until you hit 0.4 mol% methanol on the vapor curve, you would end up with around 0.1 mol% methanol in the liquid phase. That means at that temperature 0.1 mol% methanol would exist as a liquid.
Thanks
Almost right. You are asked to find the number of moles of methanol remaining in the liquid phase. To do that, you need to use the "lever rule" to find the total number of moles of liquid remaining. And the mole fraction of methanol in this liquid is 0.1; it's not 0.1 mole %.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 47 ·
2
Replies
47
Views
9K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
Replies
1
Views
5K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K