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News Syriana, Depressing and true to life.

  1. Dec 18, 2005 #1
    I just saw Syriana. It shows that little bits of corruption end up killing reform in the middle east which in turn perpetuates terrorism.

    It also does a good job of showing that many terrorists are not indoctrinated to violence, they are slowly persuaded through peer pressure to do acts they normally would not.

    what do you all think?
  2. jcsd
  3. Dec 18, 2005 #2


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    True to life? Even the producers didn't claim it was true to life from what I remember... i better go check it out (just kidding, im not fighitng these damn malls to see a movie around this time of year.).

    And why are you getting your geopolitical information from hollywood?
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2005
  4. Dec 18, 2005 #3
    True to life, meaning this is the kind of stuff that happens. They do not claim this this depicts actual events.

    Like a movie involving an injustice in the US court system, Syriana is story that speaks for all events like this one that take place.
  5. Dec 18, 2005 #4


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    Is it? How do you know?

    I'm a little wary of attaching too much reality to a fictional movie, but I haven't seen it yet, so....
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2005
  6. Dec 18, 2005 #5


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    I still don't understand how you can say "this kind of stuff happens" and then say that it doesn't depict actual events...
  7. Dec 18, 2005 #6
    a movie about a bank robbery is a movie about stuff that actually happens, but does not depict actual events.

    do you need me to be more concrete?
  8. Dec 18, 2005 #7
    You have to be a truly naive person regarding the US Government to think that we do not conduct covert operations to undermine movements that do not fit with our interests in the middle east.
  9. Dec 18, 2005 #8


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    .... thats such a non-statement. Every movie outside of disney movies are about things that actually could happen...
  10. Dec 18, 2005 #9
    then what was your point? Do you deny that the US actively undermines movements that are counter their best interests in other countries?
  11. Dec 18, 2005 #10


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    Is that you're conclusion based off a hollywood movie?

    How can the movie be about us undermining things while you say it doesnt depict real events and then you say the us undermines things based off the movie? I think you'd make sense if you got rid of the idea that it doesn't depict real events because in your opinion, it does. Everyone knows the US undermines movements in the Arab world like various radical movements or terrorist groups etc etc, the question is whether or not the movie depicts actual events or not. You are claiming they don't but then you say that what the movie depicts actually does happen which is contradictory to your opinion that it doesn't happen.
  12. Dec 18, 2005 #11
    The scripwritter for this movie was on charlie rose last friday. He said he based most of the movie on things he noted in real life. For example, he said one time he was at a card game with some rich mega powerful men, who were debating which was the next country to fall. And he goes on to say, and then the richest guy of them all said no, your all wrong, this country will fall, and ill tell you how. And a couple of weeks later exaclty that happened. Also, he went to Seria to do some background for the script, and when he got off the plane, someone called him on his cell phone. Then he was wisked away in a car and taken to the religious leader of Hezobllah. He goes on to tell the rest of his story. He was an excillent guest on the show and a magnificent story teller. I want to go see his movie once my finals are over, it should be quite good.
  13. Dec 18, 2005 #12
    http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5041385 [Broken]

    I saw this guy on television talking about the movie. He was very convincing. He stated in no uncertain terms that events depicted in the movie were very true to life. He also claimed that as a CIA agent he was involved in many operations that were similiar to those in the movie.
    Last edited by a moderator: May 2, 2017
  14. Dec 18, 2005 #13

    Rush would be proud of your ability to confuse the discussions.

    The movie is a conglomeration of activities that go on in real life but the movie itself does not depict an actual singular event.

    The US does undermine democratic movements in countries where it would hurt the US. That has been going on since the end of World War II.

    The US does send spies into other countries to get jobs done that would be against the law for those agents to do themselves.
  15. Dec 18, 2005 #14
    Don't try to convince Pengwuino, he will just claim the guy is full of it and go along his merry way.
  16. Dec 18, 2005 #15
    If the movie depicted actual events and not fictionalized versions of actual events all hell would break loose in the Middle East.
  17. Dec 18, 2005 #16
    That's OK. That is what political forums are all about.:smile:
  18. Dec 18, 2005 #17
    Guys, the movie parallels events that were claimed by this guy who was a CIA agent and the experiences of the script writter. It is not based on any one single event. That should be obvious, since it doesn't say anywhere, "based on a true story."
  19. Dec 18, 2005 #18
    So now it's only half hell that broke loose?:biggrin:
  20. Dec 18, 2005 #19
    I'm going to check my local videopirate here if they already have a copy!
  21. Dec 18, 2005 #20
    cyrusabdollahi, that was the point of the thread. To get the thoughts about the parallels to reality.
  22. Dec 18, 2005 #21
    What thoughts do you have? I think its quite obvious that the US government does things of that nature, the same way that Hezbollah does terrorist activities against the US. Its a game, no different than that played during the cold war. A game with unspoken but sometimes known rules, unknown players in unknown lands with unknown winners and loosers, if you get what im saying. We dont hear about the things the US does becuase its not on the news, but I assure you that the people living the the middle east see the effects of these things and are fully aware of what goes on, or at least gets a sniff of it on occassion.

    In actually, it has been found that most terrorists are not fundamental. They usually are guys that hit rough times, cant find jobs or are not given jobs due to their ethnic status. Out of a combination of desperation and depression, they turn to terrorism. (Although this is certainly not the only case where this happens, it is one example).
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2005
  23. Dec 19, 2005 #22


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    May as well give a little outline of the events in the film for those that haven't seen it. No spoilers, though.

    The primary story is of a plot to kill a reform-minded Prince in some unnamed middle-eastern country and influence the reigning King, who is dying, to hand over the reigns to his other son, because the reform-minded son wants to give oil contracts to a Chinese company (citing that they made a better offer and that they actually bother to learn Arabic when negotiating) and the other son is willing to give the contracts to a US company.

    There are two main subplots going on at the same time. One is about an investigation of a merger between a big oil company that will receive the oil in the aforementioned unnamed country if the little brother becomes King, and a smaller company that beat out the larger company for control of a pipeline in Kazakhstan. The other subplot is about a man and his son that get laid-off when the oil refineries in the aforementioned unnamed country come under new ownership. Since their workers visas are up, the only way for them to stay in the country (they are Pakistani) is for the son to join an Islamic school, where he is seduced into becoming a suicide bomber.

    The stories are told from the points of view of many different protagonist, including the CIA agent initially sent to assassinate the reform-minded Prince, an energy-trading consultant whose son dies at the Prince's house and is made the Prince's personal economic advisor, the investigator into the shady oil company merger, as well as the Prince and the islamic son themselves.

    The institutions that end up coming out in a bad light are 1) Middle-Eastern rulers that sell-out their countries for short-term increases in their own personal wealth and spend money on $500K cars while the infrastructure of the land crumbles, 2) large oil companies that circumvent the law to simply merge with anybody that outbids them for a coveted contract, 3) the US justice department for letting them get away with it and simply nailing a few patsies when a fuss is raised, 4) the CIA for assassinating potential leaders that would do genuine good for their own countries, but not serve the interests of the US, and 5) Islamic fundamentalist terrorist groups that seduce impressionable and hurting young men to sacrifice themselves. The only people that come out of this looking somewhat good and are sympathetically portrayed are the earnest reformers who get killed and the naive suicide bombers who get killed.
  24. Dec 19, 2005 #23
    I believe there is a presidential order stating that the CIA is not allowed to carry out assasinations. Not to say that they wouldn't try to have someone assasinated but I think that they would have to get "independant contractors" for such jobs or help out some other organization that is already wanting to assasinate the person.
  25. Dec 19, 2005 #24
    In the movie, that contractor's name is Musoui. He double crosses George Clooney after he got paid and tortures cloony's character by pulling out his fingernails (and they show it...ewww)
  26. Dec 20, 2005 #25


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    The presidential order passed in 1976 was applicable only to foreign leaders.

    There are numerous examples of CIA assassinations in recent times such as,

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