The Physics Behind Applying Force with a Load Cell

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the application of force using a load cell in conjunction with blocks under pressure. Participants explore the relationship between force, pressure, and the distribution of load among multiple blocks, considering both theoretical and practical implications.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Experimental/applied

Main Points Raised

  • One participant states that with a combined area of 20 in2 and a desired pressure of 35 PSI, the total force should be approximately 700 lbs, questioning how this force is distributed among the blocks.
  • Another participant emphasizes the need for clarity on the arrangement of the blocks, suggesting that their configuration affects the load distribution.
  • A participant mentions that the structure is statically indeterminate, indicating that the force on each block cannot be predicted without considering their position and stiffness, proposing an average load of about 117 lbs per block.
  • Some participants propose that if the blocks are nearly identical and evenly separated, the force should be nearly evenly divided among them, but acknowledge that variations in the setup could lead to different readings.
  • Concerns are raised about the load cell's stiffness and size relative to the blocks, suggesting that if the load cell is stiffer, it could take on most of the load, while if it is shorter, it might not touch the plate at all.
  • One participant suggests that the current setup may not provide useful measurements due to the potential for small variations to significantly alter the readings.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on how the load is distributed among the blocks and the effectiveness of the load cell in measuring the applied force. There is no consensus on the exact behavior of the system under the given conditions.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights uncertainties regarding the arrangement of the blocks, the stiffness of the load cell, and the overall setup, which may affect the accuracy of the measurements and the distribution of force.

Osculum
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We are applying a force with a machine that has a dial that measures lbs.
P=F/A
We have 5 blocks with a combined area of 20 in^2 and we want to apply a pressure of 35 PSI to them. Therefore F(total) for the entire Area is ~700 lbs. This is what the machine reads.
If we put the load cell on top of the blocks it should read 700 lbs (the total force applied) correct?
However, then each block should relieve the force of 140 lb (700/5), correct? Or does each block receive 700 lb?
If we put the load cell next to our blocks and therefore adding support to the entire load. will it read 700 lb or will it read 700 lb/(5+load cell)= ~140lb? do all the blocks receive 700 lbs or is it divided evenly among each block?

My boss with a pHD says the load cell should read 700 lb (the force) but it's divided among the blocks right?
 
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Osculum said:
We are applying a force with a machine that has a dial that measures lbs.
P=F/A
We have 5 blocks with a combined area of 20 in^2 and we want to apply a pressure of 35 PSI to them. Therefore F(total) for the entire Area is ~700 lbs. This is what the machine reads.
If we put the load cell on top of the blocks it should read 700 lbs (the total force applied) correct?
However, then each block should relieve the force of 140 lb (700/5), correct? Or does each block receive 700 lb?
If we put the load cell next to our blocks and therefore adding support to the entire load. will it read 700 lb or will it read 700 lb/(5+load cell)= ~140lb? do all the blocks receive 700 lbs or is it divided evenly among each block?

My boss with a pHD says the load cell should read 700 lb (the force) but it's divided among the blocks right?
It's not clear how these blocks are arranged. Are the 5 blocks stacked one on top of another, laid out flat in some array, what?

Pictures will tell a better story.
 
they are not stacked. they are spread out evenly, sandwiched between 2 heavy metal plates and then pressed. i probably shouldn't post pics of our work but here is a little example.
thanks
 

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The structure that you have is statically indeterminate. It means that you cannot predict the force on each block without considering its position and its stiffness. On average each will have about 117 lbs, but the stiffer ones will have more and the placement matters too.
 
That's what I thought. The blocks are nearly identical and (nearly) evenly separated and the force (nearly) evenly applied. Thus the force (nearly) divided amongst each block.
The load cell (next to/ in line with the blocks) measures pounds, so if 700 lb is applied it should read something close to 117-140 lb (give or take depending on the size of the load itself) but certainly not 700 correct?
 
Osculum said:
That's what I thought. The blocks are nearly identical and (nearly) evenly separated and the force (nearly) evenly applied. Thus the force (nearly) divided amongst each block.
The load cell (next to/ in line with the blocks) measures pounds, so if 700 lb is applied it should read something close to 117-140 lb (give or take depending on the size of the load itself) but certainly not 700 correct?
Not unless something is keeping the other blocks from loading up.

This arrangement doesn't seem to make a lot of sense, at least, from the standpoint of calculating what load each block supports.

If you want to test what happens if a block is loaded to 35 psi, design the test so that you know for certain that block is carrying a load which produces 35 psi.

The thickness of the plates, the arrangement of the 5 blocks, and probably a couple other factors which are not apparent, all factor into how a force applied to the plate is shared among the blocks.
 
Osculum said:
That's what I thought. The blocks are nearly identical and (nearly) evenly separated and the force (nearly) evenly applied. Thus the force (nearly) divided amongst each block.
The load cell (next to/ in line with the blocks) measures pounds, so if 700 lb is applied it should read something close to 117-140 lb (give or take depending on the size of the load itself) but certainly not 700 correct?
if the load cell is stiffer or larger than the blocks then it could be supporting most of the load. Consider the extreme cases.

If the load cell is very stiff and slightly larger than the blocks then it would take the full 700 lb load and the blocks would be unloaded.

On the opposite extreme the load cell could be enough shorter than the blocks that it doesn't even touch the plate and so would be unloaded.

Basically, this isn't a good way to measure anything useful. Small variations in the setup could change the reading from 0 to 700 lbs.
 
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