Torque with constant circular velocity

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SUMMARY

The discussion focuses on calculating the angle at which a passenger should lean in a bus making a circular turn at a constant speed of 20 km/h with a radius of 20 m. The correct formula to determine this angle is tan(α) = v²/(r*g), where v is the velocity, r is the radius, and g is the acceleration due to gravity. The initial attempt to use centripetal force and components of gravitational force was incorrect due to misunderstanding the dynamics of circular motion. The correct angle of lean is 8.9°, derived from the established relationship between linear velocity, radius, and gravitational force.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of centripetal force and its role in circular motion
  • Knowledge of basic trigonometry, specifically sine and tangent functions
  • Familiarity with Newton's laws of motion
  • Ability to apply equations of motion in a circular context
NEXT STEPS
  • Study the derivation of the centripetal force equation Fc = m*v²/r
  • Learn about the relationship between angular motion and linear motion
  • Explore the concept of torque and its application in rotational dynamics
  • Investigate the effects of different velocities and radii on the angle of lean in circular motion
USEFUL FOR

This discussion is beneficial for physics students, educators, and anyone interested in understanding the dynamics of motion in circular paths, particularly in real-world applications such as transportation and vehicle dynamics.

Matejxx1
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Homework Statement



a passenger with height 175cmis driving on a city bus. The center of mass is at h=110cm above the middle point of the shoe which are 30 cm long. The passenger is standing in the direction of the ride.
h=175cm
h*=110cm
shoe size = 30 cm

b)
the bus is driving in a circle which has the radius of 20m with a constant speed of 20 km/h.For what angle relative to the vertical axis should the passenger lean so that he/she would not tip over.

Homework Equations


Fc=m*v2/r
Fn=m*g*cosα
Fx=m*g*sinα


The Attempt at a Solution


So here is what I tried to do
fc=m*(20/3,6)2/20..... I got Fc=1,543m
and here is something I don't understand. Since the centripetal force is acting toward the center of the circle, why is it incorrect to just use the Fx component of m*g
I tried doing it like this
Fc=1,543m Fx=m*g*sinα...since the body is not moving Torque=0
1,543m=m*g*sinα
sinα=(1.543*m)/(m*g) the masses cancel out
sin=1.543/9.8
sinα=0,157
α=9.05°

which is incorrect. The right answer is 8.9° and the end equation should look like this
tanα=v2/(r*g)
Can someone please explain or help me get to this equation tanα=v2/(r*g) [/b]
Thank you for reading
 
Last edited:
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Matejxx1 said:
So here is what I tried to do
fc=m*(20/3,6)2/20..... I got Fc=1,543m
Are you given the mass of the passenger?
What are the units for Fc?

...and here is something I don't understand. Since the centripetal force is acting toward the center of the circle, why is it incorrect to just use the Fx component of m*g
... you mean the horizontal component of the weight?
Cartesian coordinates don't make a lot of sense here.

I tried doing it like this
Fc=1,543m Fx=m*g*sinα...since the body is not moving
... but the body is moving - in fact, for the term "centripetal force" to make sense, it must be accelerating: i.e. moving in a circle. So it must be acted on by an unbalanced force.

If I read you correctly, you tried to arrange to have zero horizontal force.

In the inertial frame, the net force on the body must point horizontally towards the center of the turn and sufficient to maintain circular motion. There should be zero net torque as well because the body has zero angular acceleration - it is rotating because it is constantly oriented along the axis of the turning bus.
 

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