Two rockets rotating attached by rod

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a physics problem involving two rockets connected by a rod, focusing on concepts of rotational dynamics, center of mass, and moment of inertia.

Discussion Character

  • Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the calculation of the center of mass and its implications on the dynamics of the system. There are attempts to clarify the treatment of the moment of inertia, particularly regarding the rod's configuration and how it affects the overall calculations.

Discussion Status

Some participants have offered insights into the calculations and assumptions made, questioning the treatment of the rod and its moment of inertia. There is an ongoing exploration of different methods to approach the problem, with no explicit consensus reached yet.

Contextual Notes

Participants are discussing the implications of treating the center of mass as fixed versus moving, and there are references to specific formulas for moment of inertia that may not fully apply in the context of the problem.

Esoremada
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Homework Statement



http://puu.sh/5nKxl.png

Homework Equations



α = ω/t
τ = I*α

The Attempt at a Solution



CM = [232200*99 + 99/2*12500] / (107100 + 232200 + 12500)
= 67.102 m


τ = 43320*67.102 + 43320*(99 - 67.102)
= 4288680 N

α = ω/t
τ = I*α
τ = I*(ω/t)

ω = τ/I * t
= 4288680 / [107100*67.1022 + 1250*(67.102 - 99/2)2 + 232200*(99-67.102)2] * 28.3
= 0.1688
 
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Your answer would have been correct if the CoM had been fixed in space on an axle. What will happen instead?
 
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haruspex said:
Your answer would have been correct if the CoM had been fixed in space on an axle. What will happen instead?

The CoM moves through space, but how can that affect this question when the distance from the centre of mass to the ships remains the same regardless of orientation and speed relative to space.
 
Yes, thinking about this again I believe your method is correct, but in the calculation you treated the tunnel as a point mass at its centre. That slightly underestimates the moment of inertia of the system. I get 0.166. Is that error enough to explain your answer's rejection?
 
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haruspex said:
Yes, thinking about this again I believe your method is correct, but in the calculation you treated the tunnel as a point mass at its centre. That slightly underestimates the moment of inertia of the system. I get 0.166. Is that error enough to explain your answer's rejection?

That was correct! So what is the correct way to calculate the moment of a inertia of a rod about a given pivot? I only know that it is 1/12*ML^2 and 1/3*ML^2 for pivots about the centre or end.
 
Esoremada said:
That was correct! So what is the correct way to calculate the moment of a inertia of a rod about a given pivot? I only know that it is 1/12*ML^2 and 1/3*ML^2 for pivots about the centre or end.
Use the parallel axis theorem. The MoI about one end is simply a special case of that.
 
Oh cool I never even noticed that. I get how to derive 1/3*ML^2 now but I try doing it in this problem and get it wrong

1250*(67.102 - 99/2)^2 + 1/12*1250*99^2

That's the moment of the rod rotating about its centre plus the moment of the rod's centre of mass rotating about the systems centre of mass. What am I doing wrong?
 
Esoremada said:
Oh cool I never even noticed that. I get how to derive 1/3*ML^2 now but I try doing it in this problem and get it wrong

1250*(67.102 - 99/2)^2 + 1/12*1250*99^2

That's the moment of the rod rotating about its centre plus the moment of the rod's centre of mass rotating about the systems centre of mass. What am I doing wrong?
Isn't it 12500?
 
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...I need more sleep. Thanks again :P
 
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What about treating the rod as two rods rotating about one end, where that commen one end is the center of mass?
 
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