Understanding Particle Behavior: Electrons and Protons at a Distance of 1cm

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the behavior of electrons and protons when separated by a distance of 1 cm, particularly focusing on their interactions when a screen is removed. Participants explore concepts related to potential energy, particle paths, and the implications of quantum mechanics versus classical physics in explaining these phenomena.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions why an electron and a proton do not collide directly when separated by a screen, suggesting that they should meet and clash if the screen is removed.
  • Another participant explains that potential energy (PE) is involved and proposes that the electron could follow either a hyperbolic or elliptical path, noting that high energies are required for a direct collision.
  • Some participants discuss the nature of particle interactions, suggesting that classical physics does not adequately describe the behavior of subatomic particles, and that quantum mechanics is necessary for understanding these interactions.
  • There are mentions of the formation of hydrogen atoms as a likely outcome when the electron and proton come close together, with discussions on the initial velocities and forces involved.
  • One participant raises a question about the forces that cause the electron to deviate from a straight path, inquiring whether magnetic forces are involved.
  • Another participant emphasizes that classical deflection does not apply in quantum mechanics, indicating that the final state retains the same symmetry as the initial state.
  • Several participants express uncertainty about the explanations provided by quantum mechanics, questioning whether it offers a clear understanding of the forces at play.
  • There are references to historical developments in physics, including the limitations of classical ideas and the evolution of quantum theory.
  • One participant expresses frustration over the lack of a satisfactory explanation for the behavior of particles, suggesting that quantum mechanics has not yet provided clarity on the matter.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants exhibit a mix of agreement and disagreement, with some acknowledging the limitations of classical physics while others question the clarity of quantum mechanics. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the exact nature of particle paths and the forces involved.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that classical physics may not adequately describe quantum phenomena, and there are unresolved questions about the specific energies and forces influencing particle behavior. The discussion touches on complex mathematical and conceptual challenges without arriving at definitive answers.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those studying quantum mechanics, particle physics, or anyone curious about the interactions between subatomic particles and the implications of different physical theories.

  • #31
Do you know the value of the amplitude of the wave at c/3?
Is it possible to detect and measure with instruments the length and the amplitude of the wave of an electron?
Is that wave electromagnetic like light?
 
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  • #32
The quantum wave is not electromagnetic; it is a probability amplitude ... it tells you how likely something is to be detected at each point in space. The probability for point X is |psi(X)|^2.

I do not know the probability amplitudes for the electrons in my system. But when you take an introductory QM course this type of calculation will be covered in one of the early lectures, or else will be a homework problem - it is one of the easiest as it represents the "free Hamiltonian": the only parameter is the momentum, hence only the kinetic energy appears in the Hamiltonian: H=p^2/2m.

You cannot directly measure the probability amplitudes, though it is possible to measure their effects when your experiment takes measurements: if the measurements are repeated you will see the probability distribution filled in. For example, I could see the probability distribution predicted by the electron diffraction process fill in, point by point on my imaging system.
 

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