Use kinematic equations if acceleration is time dependent?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the application of kinematic equations when acceleration is time-dependent, specifically exploring whether these equations can be modified to accommodate a function of time for acceleration. Participants also delve into the concept of expressing position, acceleration, and velocity as functions of distance traveled.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the validity of using kinematic equations for constant acceleration when acceleration is a function of time, suggesting that integration is necessary to find velocity and position.
  • Another participant agrees with the need to integrate the time-dependent acceleration to derive velocity and subsequently position.
  • A participant raises the idea of expressing position, acceleration, and velocity as functions of distance traveled, questioning if this is known as parametrization in terms of arc length.
  • There is a clarification regarding the terminology of "distance traveled" versus "displacement," with a participant emphasizing that displacement is a vector quantity and should not be treated as a scalar in general contexts.
  • Another participant mentions that parameterization can be applied if a relationship exists to connect the variables, citing Hooke's law as an example.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that kinematic equations for constant acceleration cannot be directly applied when acceleration is time-dependent, and that integration is required. However, there is no consensus on the best approach to express motion in terms of distance traveled, with differing views on the terminology and concepts involved.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes nuances regarding the definitions of displacement and distance, as well as the conditions under which parameterization can be applied. There are unresolved aspects regarding the specific methods for expressing motion in terms of distance.

fog37
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Hello forum,
The kinematic equations for motion with constant acceleration are:

v_f = v_0 + a*t
x_f = x_0 + v_0 * t +(0.5) a*t^2

The acceleration a is a constant.

Is it possible to use them if the acceleration is not constant but a function of time? For example, a(t)= 3t^2+2?
Can we simply replace a(t) in the equations above? I don't think so.

Do we need to solve dv/dt= a(t) for v(t) and the integrate v(t) to find the expression for x(t)?

I found a website that discusses time-dependent acceleration:
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/avari.html#c1

thanks
fog37
 
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fog37 said:
Hello forum,
The kinematic equations for motion with constant acceleration are:

v_f = v_0 + a*t
x_f = x_0 + v_0 * t +(0.5) a*t^2

The acceleration a is a constant.

Is it possible to use them if the acceleration is not constant but a function of time? For example, a(t)= 3t^2+2?
Can we simply replace a(t) in the equations above? I don't think so.

Do we need to solve dv/dt= a(t) for v(t) and the integrate v(t) to find the expression for x(t)?

I found a website that discusses time-dependent acceleration:
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/avari.html#c1

thanks
fog37
You can't just replace a by a(t) in the equations that are valid for constant acceleration.
Basically, you have to integrate a(t) to get v(t), and integrate v(t) to get x(t).

The website you mentioned shows it clearly: http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/acons.html#c3
acc.jpg
 
Ok thanks! all clear.

We are usually working with position versus time, acceleration versus time, velocity versus time: x(t), a(t), v(t)

The distance traveled s is a scalar. Is it possible to express position x, acceleration a, and velocity v as a function of s? Is that called parametrization in term of arch length? How could I do that? Do you have a simple example?
 
fog37 said:
Ok thanks! all clear.

We are usually working with position versus time, acceleration versus time, velocity versus time: x(t), a(t), v(t)

The distance traveled s is a scalar. Is it possible to express position x, acceleration a, and velocity v as a function of s? Is that called parametrization in term of arch length? How could I do that? Do you have a simple example?

Wait.. back off a bit. "Distance traveled" is often designated as "displacement". This is NOT a scalar. It has distance AND direction!

Now, it is often treated as a "scalar" when one is only dealing with 1D problems. In that case, the only thing you care about if it is to the "left" or to the "right" of the origin. But do not confuse this as generalizing displacement as being a scalar.

Secondly, you can parameterize anything IF there is a relationship to connect them. In Hooke's law, the force can be expressed as a function of the displacement from equilibrium, i.e. a function of distance, not time.

Zz.
 
I did not mean displacement (which is a vector), either instantaneous or average, but the length of the trajectory at a specific instant of time as the independent variable for either velocity vector or position vector

Thanks,
 

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